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Android (avc.com)
151 points by cwan on April 2, 2011 | hide | past | favorite | 85 comments



From the point of view of a developer, one counter-point is that the App Store still makes far more revenue than the Android Marketplace (about 17x more, to be precise), so iOS is still a better platform of choice [1].

A counter-point to that counter-point is that Android's Marketplace has far fewer apps than the App Store (about 4x fewer), and far fewer paid apps (about 2x fewer) [2].

That 8x factor still doesn't explain the 17x difference in revenue. My guess is that the typical Android app is of lower quality (since the store is not moderated) and lower priced in comparison to iPhone apps.

At any rate, given this dramatic change in market share, it seems to me that not deploying for the Android platform at this point is a dangerous proposition, except perhaps if your primary customer acquisition channel is the platform's built-in store/marketplace.

[1] http://techcrunch.com/2011/02/21/861-5-percent-growth-androi...

[2] http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13970_7-20032228-78.html


Those are paid app revenues only, though. Because of Google's focus on advertising, that's becoming a very viable alternative method of revenue for app producers. Look at Angry Birds, who is bringing $1m per month on Android [1] and doesn't have to sell to as many new customers to maintain those numbers. Eventually, they're going to hit a wall. $.99 is great up front, but $0.05 a month from 5x the number of customers is better.

[1] http://www.intomobile.com/2010/12/03/angry-birds-android-1-m...


Angry Birds on Android was launched off of the success on the iPhone though. Not that invalidates their success on the Android platform or anything, just that it doesn't speak to the power of the Android platform, since it probably would never have happened if not for their previous success on the iPhone. I.e. the Angry Birds story is not a good example of when focusing on Android rather than iOS would have been a good idea.

Can you think of any Android exclusive app or game that is achieving a similar success? Then that app is probably a better example.


There's probably a lagging effect in quality on Android. 8 months ago, a lot of mobile companies were spinning up. Android was a big question mark, and iOS was an obvious juggernaut.

I'm imagining that a lot of resources have been thrown at Android apps over the past few months in anticipation of continuing growth. We'll see the fruits of that in the coming months.


There seems to be a "small" difference between this and the Windows analogy: Apple got into the mass market this time and its users are showing money. If Apple can keep at least 10% of the market then it might as well have more than 50% of the people-that-actually-buy-apps market like you show.

Let's assume this scenario of 50%. Then it all boils down to how better it is to develop to one platform against the other.

And, to keep it in perspective, I didn't even mention the iPad here...

I always thought Apple was going for the wrong strategy here, once again (like the article points), but I'm starting to doubt it.


>Apple got into the mass market this time and its >users are showing money. If Apple can keep at least >10% of the market then it might as well have more than >50% of the people-that-actually-buy-apps market like you show.

At the risk of aging myself, I had an IBM PC in 1981 and watched friends get Macs. The quote above sounds as if it were lifted directly from that time period. The main difference between then and now is that the mobile market is already very large and relatively well explored. Apple's strategy seems nearly identical. Any of this sound familiar?: lots of overpriced peripherals; proprietary networking (see FaceTime); all new technology!... that then basically didn't change for 15 years (co-operative multitasking up until about '00); created the perfect interface and wrote a book about it!... then would only change about the interface in response to competitive pressure.

I don't think Apple is going to have anything like 50% market share of phones or app purchasers. As the article pointed out, the mobile market is going to be won in developing countries and that's precisely where Apple can't play.


Paid apps aren't very relevant in the long term though, for several reasons:`

- It's a race to the bottom. New competitors enter and price their app lower to compete. Existing players are forced to adapt. Marginal cost is zero so apps eventually settle at the lowest possible price point at which there is revenue ($1).

- People buy apps only once. Right now the market is growing, but once it has become saturated (everyone has a smartphone), sales for existing apps will drop to near zero.

- Freemium always wins the low-end. The low-end doesn't pay for content, so the only way to reach them is to offer the content for free. Revenue is made through advertising or by up-selling after adoption. The web went free because it turns out the low-end is bigger than the high-end.

If it's a given that the paid app market is going to dry up (and I think it is), then it's also a given that app developers will have to have a free strategy. Going free means having more eyeballs, because revenue per user is lower. So, you need to be on the biggest platform, and android is going to be the biggest platform. Why? Because google "gets it" and is spending all their resources into buying up market share, including the low-end (where most eyeballs are). Apple is not going to fight for the low-end, it's not in their DNA. Everyone else is simply not in a position to compete.


Good points.

Another aspect to consider is that some Android users don't even know that they are Android users. I don't know how many, but speaking from personal experience, it seems a non-negligible percentage of "normal" Android users simply bought a touch screen smartphone in the lower end of the market, because that's what carriers are pushing now. It's running Android, but the owner doesn't know it, and isn't familiar with any marketplace to download apps.

iPhone users though, they know that they have an iPhone and what that entails. Meaning, they know what the AppStore is, and Apple has their credit card information. Some even had an Apple account before they got an iPhone — if they had an iPod previously they can just start buying apps right away.

Counting users is one thing, but what you should be counting are active users of respective marketplaces/app stores.


From a perspective of the general types of apps sold on mobile phones to similar mostly one-function apps and games, I think the comparison to Windows vs. Mac holds through. On Windows, most of the smaller utilities and games are generally free and it is hard to sell them to the average consumer, whereas on Mac it is much more common to find small-scale projects that are commercial. This divide is only going to be more accelerated with new easier ways of payment for applications such as the app store.


I think it's simply that Apple/iOS users spend more money. IOS is the more mainstream platform and you have general/non-tech users on the platform buying relatively cheap apps, at least by their previous standards (they'd gotten use to 59.95 for a game software for example). In general I think iOS users just spend more money as a whole.

Android seems to be favored by users that prefer free software and simply spend less as a group.


How do the market share numbers look when you factor in iPads and iPod touches? The numbers look impressive for Android, but assuming app purchasing behaviors are the same on both platforms and mobile economics do end up looking like web economics Apple is still placing WAY more units in the field and covering a much broader demographic, from 6 year olds with the iPod touch to grandmoms with the iPad. I wouldn't underestimate iOS and their ability to make consumers happy.


You make a good point. But if you're looking at it as a winner-take-all (or winner-take-most) market like a lot people do, the phone is where the battle lies. Once your phone is beefy enough to be your media player, game machine, phone, and GPS, most people won't have differentiated / specialized devices.

Q4 iPod sales were down 11% year over year. I'd look for that to accelerate as smartphones become more ubiquitous.

If you want #s of everything, here's what a quick googling yielded:

Android shipped 33.5M devices in Q4 Apple shipped 27.34M iPhones/iPads/iPods in Q4 (~14M iphones, ~4M iPads, ~9M iPods)

Presumably some meaningful percentage of iPods were NOT iPod touches (i.e. no App Store), so shave 3-5M off of Apple if you're trying to guess iOS devices.

So conservatively, about a third more Android devices shipped in q4 than all iOS devices combined. That's BEFORE the 7% market share boost that Fred is talking about.

(this is quick/sloppy research-- feel free to point to better #s).


Where did you get these numbers? In my research, I couldn't find good comparisons at all. I saw some info in various places attributed to Canalys that showed 33 million iOS vs 32.7 Android unit sales in Q4. I also saw Schmidt claim 300k daily Android phone activations in Q4 with Apple's Q4 earnings report extrapolating to 375k daily iOS sales. Did Android have 75k daily sales of non-phone Android devices? Maybe if we include Nooks and things? Is this even really a useful comparison between two things anymore? Would a consumer recognize a Nook as being the same thing as a Droid, in the same way they recognize an iPod Touch is the same thing as an iPhone? This isn't an idle question since, e.g., millions of the Android activations are coming from phones in China with totally different user experiences. In my opinion, Android is not homogeneous enough to compare against iOS in the way that Windows vs Mac OS used to be.



Those Apple figures are for calendar Q3, Apple's financial Q4 so you're not comparing the same time period. Apple generally get a big bump in iPad and iPod sales in the christmas quarter.

I'm fairly confident that Android is far enough ahead in smartphones sales (i.e. more than double globally, more than triple in the U.S.) that you can include iPods and they're still ahead and the gap is growing. I'll wait till I see a few quarters of numbers for the Android tablets before I'd be happy assessing how they're doing against iPad sales.

edit: Here's what Apple call their Q1 results, covering Q4 2010:

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2011/01/18results.html

iPod sales declined 7% year-on-year, the 33 million iOS (pod+pad+phone) number mentioned above which would roughly equal Android smartphone sales last quarter works out if you assume half of all iPods are iPod Touches (I have no idea if that is true, either historically or currently).


Ophone (the China Mobile Android fork) sales were about 1/3 million last year, which is less than half a percent of the 70 million Android sales in 2010. They were only aiming for 1 million so even if they hit that target it wouldn't make much difference. Android sales generally are growing fast while Ophone is supposedly a failure because it can't keep up with mainline Android development.

The Canalys numbers only covered smartphones (16.2 for Apple in Q4 2010) so the rest of the figures must have been added by someone else.

And the Schmidt number was over 300,000 daily activations at the start of Q4 (it had jumped around 100,000 in the previous two months and growth appeared to be accelerating). Canalys numbers translate to about 366K per day averaged over Q4. It appears later sales rates must be over 400K to bring that average up to that level.


But Android has the same range, from the $99 Archos 28 to the $800 Xoom. Plus the off-brand stuff like $99 7" tablets at CVS.


AFAIK, the archos 28 ships without the full android market.


That is true. And Archos's own AppsLib just does not measure up, from a developer's viewpoint. I've got two apps that have gotten over 100 downloads each in the Market, and only 2 from AppsLib.


I feel these kind of stats will always be flawed for the following reason:

- It doesn't include other devices running iOS (as a developer I look at those too, especially if my app doesn't require Internet).

- It doesn't consider that a big % of Android phones run apps horribly if not at all. Also most of this phone we'll never be easily upgradable to a newer OS version (I don't care if you can do it, I'm talking about for "normal" people), because the carriers and manufactures prefer pushing the new phones that come out every other week.


I can't tell if you're trying to convince us, or convince yourself.


Not trying to convince anyone. I was just stating that as a developer, I could be interested in more than 50% of the iOS market, and I could be interested in having my application being able to run on as many devices as possible of such market.

That doesn't mean that I wouldn't love to tackle the Android market as well, and we'll definitely do that. But we have limited resources so we chose the one that at the moment generates the most revenues.


No issue with counting iP*d's, that only makes sense. What I was trying to figure out was the big percentage of Android phones that [... or] don't run applications at all". Have a list of those?


I meant, given an application, there's a good chance that it won't run on run on all the Android phones.


I could say the same about Apple's iOS (e.g. you can use hardware not present in all devices, or target APIs that not all devices have (or are even capable of being) upgraded to), and it wouldn't be be an accurate reflection of the real situation there either.

Unless you put numbers on it, then it's an empty statement.


I'd say as a developer, all I care about is a nice niche market to serve with a development environment I enjoy. All of that world domination, battle stuff doesn't interest me very much at all.


No need for condescension.

He's making at least one very important point: Looking at smartphone market share ignores iPod and iPad. The numbers would be different if it was Google App Store target devices (mainly handsets) versus Apple App Store target devices (significant number of iPads and especially iPod Touches in addition to iPhones).


no issue with that part


In his post, Fred dismisses critics by saying "I got a lot of heat from Apple fanboys for that post"

However, you don't have to be a "fanboy" to recognize that Fred is a huge proponent of "free". It makes sense for VCs to promote a zero-revenue, high-growth, "free" approach.imo that explains a lot of Fred's bias towards Android.

I'd say that vc-funded companies should develop on both iPhone and Android (as Color did).

However, most developers will be better off with iOS, if they can only invest in one platform - unless their business model is strongly predicated on a "free" app monetization model.


Fred is a big proponent of "open", which is great, but it's still not clear that "open" is going to win this game.

The battle between Windows and Apple wasn't just about "open" versus closed. It was about availability of third party software. It was about ability to distribute effectively. It was about mindshare. There are other reasons that Apple was not successful through the late 80's to 90's (even when they allowed third party computer manufacturers like Franklin to license their OS). But Apple is an entirely different beast now. And Android appears to be on it's way to such a wide variety of configurations that it may not even be recognizable as Android at some point - what if Amazon's app store becomes real popular? At that point, are you developing for Android or are you developing for Amazon?

I wonder how many major corporations out there right now that are thinking of how tablets could fit into their work environments are playing around with the Android OS? My guess is not many.


Android is going to "dominate" in the same way that Microsoft still "dominates" the desktop. That is, it might end up with a larger share of the market because it ends up getting distributed on 101 phones, but the actually valuable and choosy end of the market will still be on the iPhone. I'm sure Apple's quaking in its boots that it'll get to maintain its crazy profit margins while people are making pennies on the Android.


I'm sure Google is terrified of becoming like Microsoft's Windows and Office divisions too.


Well the MS Office division is pretty profitable...


By "dominates", you mean racks in nearly $20B a year in profits?


Maybe they mean, dominate like Microsoft in the sense of "use your insane profits to prop up Apple rather than allow them to go out of business entirely, simply to avoid further antitrust scrutiny"?


The disparaging use of the term fanboy is disappointing from someone who I respect like Fred.

Can't we just prefer one good product to another equally good product without being reduced to "fanboys"?


I'm not sure it's important to predict now whether iOS or Android is going to be bigger or more profitable to developers. They're both going to be enormous and they're both going to be around for a long time, just like the Window-Mac horse race from the 1980s to now. There's a lot of money to be made on either - or both. Going back to the Windows-Mac comparison, though, think of all the horses that aren't still in the race from the 1980s: CP/M, Amiga, OS/2, etc. That's the question for the mobile marketplace. What is going to be the mobile equivalent of those? WebOS? Symbian? Windows 7?


In terms of market, Android is like China while iOS is USA/Japan.

The Chinese market is huge but they do not have the spending power of the Americans or Japanese yet.

Companies will probably not make a lot of money in China right now but it is wise for them to try to penetrate the Chinese market sooner than later so they'll be in good position when things pick up.

This is similar to Android's position. Not a lot of money to be made yet but it would be a foolish move not position yourself in the market.


The most fascinating part of the smartphone battle is that Google/Android has basically stopped and reversed a giant vertical integration play by Apple. Markets swing back and forth between integrated and disintegrated and Google grabbed the pendulum and pushed it back toward 'disintegrated'.


Since iPhone market share is still growing, Google clearly hasn't reversed anything yet. Android tablets might still defeat the iPad, but for now that's just talk.

What Google has done is provide an OS that let's the 'disintegrated' market show up at all, and achieve volume through low pricing and wider availability. This is a huge achievement, because without them the other manufacturers would be lost. That said, even if there had been no Android, could Apple have sold more iPhones? They seem to be selling them as fast as they are able to make them.

I suggest that major advantages will be conferred on whoever achieves greater synergies across the ecosystem of devices (i.e. makes devices work better together).

So far, neither platform has a decisive advantage here. The question is, who is better positioned to move forward?

Google, who don't have a completed tablet story, are stumbling with TVs, and are struggling to contain fragmentation on their phone? or Apple, who have the Phone and Tablet well under control, are well on their way to bringing the desktop into the picture, and have a smoothly improving TV story?

If I were Google, I'd be trying to counter this using the Web and the Cloud - which we see them doing with things like Cloud Print, but it's not obvious how strong their strategy is yet, especially since they can't easily roll out new capabilities to their existing users. That said, they could end up with a trump card (e.g. mobile payments).

The game is levelling up, and we have yet to see either side show their cards let alone stop the other in its tracks.


The table indicates that Google's share growth (+7.0%) has come at the expense of RIM (-4.6%) Microsoft (-1.3%) and Palm (-1.1%). Apple's share continued to grow (+0.2%). The breakdown is similar for all of comScore's figures for the last six months.


Does it even make sense to talk about share growth coming at anyone's expense when the market is growing this quickly? Is the absolute number of RIM phones falling? At this point I doubt any appreciable percentage is accounted for by people switching from one platform to another.


RIMs sales are still rising and Apple's market share growth, which has been flat for about a year, translates into somewhere between 50 and 100% sales growth. Meanwhile Android sales are up 800-1200% so yes, it's mostly about who's getting the new entrants to the smartphone market.


I'm a little disappointed that Fred has fallen into the seductive trap of comparing Android and iOS to Windows and Mac. It's superficially attractive but doesn't stand up to any serious scrutiny.

What's winning here isn't openness (which has many, many definitions), it's commoditization. Android is successfully commoditizing the smartphone market, which is good for Google, good for consumers and bad for the carriers and handset makers (who are willing accessories in their race to the bottom).

A better analogy (IMHO) is, in gaming terms, PCs (Android) vs consoles (iOS).

PCs are more powerful than consoles (except for a short window when the console is released). This of course depends on what (if any) graphics card the PC has. PCs (despite Windows) are essentially "open". You can install what applications, devices, drivers, etc you want. Technically you can replace Windows with something like Linux too (but that won't do your gaming any favours).

Consoles are essentially a closed system. The device is protected from modification (to some degree). Publishing games requires meeting hefty requirements laid out by the console maker (and license fees).

The benefit of the console model is clear: consumer don't need to mess around with them. They just turn them on and they work. Gaming publishers can develop to a much wider audience with a fixed hardware platform.

We've now reached a point where 3D graphics have basically gotten as good as they need to for the vast majority of consumers. It's a bit like the move from video to DVD was huge (in terms of quality). DVD to Blu-ray? The majority of consumers still don't care (and probably never will).

Better graphics engine in games basically translates into higher art/content costs and that is a case of diminishing returns.

So consoles are basically killing off PC gaming (except for a few niche genres)--and here's the key point--because the hardware is as good as it needs to be.

None of this was true in the Windows vs Mac era. The rapid development of Windows-based PCs, both in terms of raw power and price-performance, is really what killed the Mac.

That power is now of far diminished importance. In the mobile market, in some ways, more power is less desirable because it comes at a cost in battery life, size and weight (none of which were ever relevant to the Windows vs Mac debate, other than for laptops). Now shrinking transistors does lead to increases in power but that is fairly predictable and uniform across all platforms.

Consumers, give enough power, start valuing other things like the UI, the design of the device, the ecosystem, the brand and so on (basically this is a "need" to "want" transition).

In all of these areas Apple has a huge lead.

But Apple only produces one handset at the very top of the market. Android wins total market share in smartphones for two primary reasons:

1. Most people just use their phones as phones (diminishing the value of the ecosystem); and

2. Android competes in a lot of markets the iPhone doesn't.

So I concede that Android seems likely to dominate the phone market at this point. I just don't think it's terribly relevant to the future of mobile computing.

The future (IMHO) is about tablets, a market where Apple has an enormous lead and huge advantages, one where the halo effect is likely to benefit everything else they produce.


I'm a little disappointed that (a) people have short memories or (b) everybody else is 10 years younger than me, at least

    Fred has fallen into the seductive trap of comparing 
    Android and iOS to Windows and Mac ... What's
    winning here isn't openness (which has many, many
    definitions), it's commoditization
Windows "commoditized" PC hardware -- the differences between smartphones and what happened in the nineties are few and far between, even though you're struggling to look for reasons why it's not ;-)

    The rapid development of Windows-based PCs, 
    both in terms of raw power and price-performance, 
    is really what killed the Mac.
That's inaccurate -- standardization between multiple PC makers and the availability of PCs is really what killed the Mac ... I don't live in the US; my first computer was built by a local company (it was cheap too). Apple couldn't and still can't compete with that.

    Consumers, give enough power, start valuing 
    other things like the UI, the design of the device,
    the ecosystem, the brand and so on
Before OS X, Mac OS was a piece of shit -- again, you're wish-believing; as if "price" and having a standard between multiple smartphone makers is suddenly less important.

    Android competes in a lot of markets the 
    iPhone doesn't
Markets also converge -- in the early nineties IBM's OS/2 was promoted as this next-generation OS (and it was kick-ass), while Windows was the cheap solution for 286 PCs. SOFTWARE is so liquid that markets don't have clearly defined lines; and if you're telling me the iPhone is this superior alternative for people who want superior stuff, then the iPhone already lost the battle.

    The future (IMHO) is about tablets
The future, from my perspective, is convergence of every house/office appliance we have to being a personal general-computing device, including your fridge and your toaster.

And you can call a PC by any other name, but it's still a PC.

Saying that the future is about tables is really shortsighted; here I was hoping for something as big as the Internet.


1. Local PC clone companies used to reign but these days seems the big boys like HP, Dell, Sony, Acer have recaptured the share. The market for tech has gotten large enough that it seems to be more brand-driven than spec-driven.

That's the main difference between mobile devices today and the PC wars of the 80s. The market (thus far) is no longer interested in low cost custom builds, they're looking for an all-in-one experience. Though perhaps there is room for both approaches in the market, and there won't be quite a winner-take-all scenario here.

2. Mac OS was NOT a piece of shit, though I guess it depends on your priorities. For those that loved it, it was brilliantly designed and useable. They (mostly) forgave its Windows 95-esque brittleness.

3. Saying that every appliance includes a PC doesn't say much about what the computing experience will be like. I personally don't think my fridge and toaster will have much more power than they do today, because I can't see the utility in that (adjusting my fridge temperature from work? eh?).

But I do believe that smart phones & tablets will be the predominant mode of "mainstream computing", given how quickly the iPad is growing.


What's beating Apple (in terms of market share) is that they aggressively protect their control and massive margins.

If you buy an iPhone, a ton of dollars find their way into Apple's pockets and a comparatively smaller pile of dollars make it to carriers, handset makers, and even companies like Pandora/Kindle as Apple moves to own ANY subscription that originates on their phone.

If you buy an Android phone, a lot more companies get a taste of the revenue pie... Basically incentivizing carriers, handset makers, and companies like Pandora and Amazon (Kindle) to spend their marketing and R&D dollars pushing Android.

This is what happened with Apple v. Windows. Apple's product brilliance + marketing dollars simply couldn't match the market power of Microsoft + all of the hardware & software companies that wanted a piece of the action.

The new fight is more interesting-- Apple has a much bigger head start in the market, ownership of the new tablet market, and near-domination in the music vertical with iTunes. But Apple is setting themselves up to be tangling with the combined (and increasingly aligned) market might of carriers, MSFT, Google, Amazon, music labels, and more. Helluva battle coming.


I wrote my own piece on iPhone vs Android using the Mac vs Windows analogy three years ago. It's dated pretty well except for two points. The first being that there was no Android Market at the time, the other that there was no iPad or Android tablets on the horizon at that time. http://palmaddict.typepad.com/palmaddicts/2008/04/mobile-pla...


Uh!? Assuming, Android is commoditizing the smartphone hardware, couldn't we say the same thing about Microsoft and computer hardware?


I agree that the windows v. Mac comparison falls apart on scrutiny but not for the same reason. I think that android commoditization of the smartphone is very comparable to how windows commoditizatized the the pc.


I disagree.

PCs had a different (open) hardware architecture using chips, chipsets, motherboards and other components from a variety of manufacturers (Intel, AMD, Cyrix, Nvidia (later), etc).

Macs had their own architecture from top to bottom from the Motorola chips (680x0, PowerPC, etc) to even the system interconnects.

This custom hardware slowed down the innovation at Apple and drove up the cost at a time when horsepower was really important.

What killed the Mac was cost and scale so when the final nail in the coffin came with Windows 95 (which exceeded the technical capabilities of MacOS in about every way, UI sensibilities notwithstanding) the disparity was vast.

Now? The upper bound on power isn't cost or availability, it's something far more immovable: battery life, size and weight. All the while, CPU differences are largely nonexistent (Snapdragon, Apple's A4/A5, etc).

So, to be clear, you could buy a better (specced) PC for less money than a Mac. Now you can buy a worse Android phone for less money. There's obviously a market for low cost handsets but I don't think anyone can argue that any Android hardware is significantly better than Apple hardware in any way that consumers actually care about.

You see this in, say, the TV market too. If the cheaper but worse hardware argument held then Chinese TVs would kill off higher quality brands. I once heard there are three tiers of TVs: Japanese (top), Korean (middle) and Chinese (bottom).

Chinese TVs are obviously a big market but they aren't the entire market. Nor are Samsung (Korean), Sony or Panasonic going anywhere anytime soon.


Don't you think, that initially, the Mac had a performance advantage because it was integrated? i.e. The hardware details, OS, software was all carefully designed to give snappy performance, despite low specs.

But this lead didn't last long, and the picture you describe came about within a few years.

For Android/iPhone: as soon as the separate components become the source of performance (speed, battery life), rather than the intricate integration of them (SoC design, battery, display, OS, apps, appstore, toolchain, etc), then Android will win.

e.g. Currently, an Android with a faster processor is less snappy than an iPhone. But when processors are fast enough, the difference won't be noticeable - even if the iPhone is still faster.

My prediction is that if Apple can keep finding improvements that users care about (e.g. slimness, lightness etc) that offset gains in component performance, and benefit from how exactly it is all integrated, then it will retain leadership. I also think that this lead cannot last forever.

Apple doesn't expect it to - they'll be on to the next cool thing, where the benefits of integration again become crucial (e.g. the next smaller form-factor).

One thing that's different today is that ARM's SoC market itself is vibrant, and so the processor won't stagnate like the 680x0 did - even if Apple's internal team does stagnate, they can just buy another team (like how they got the A5 guys). They can even mix and match different components within the SoC. From what you're saying, this is what makes it different from round one.


As of the iPhone 4 release, you could buy slightly better hardware in a Android phone for the same/less (e.g. Galaxy S, near identical hardware but better GPU and faster clock). Since the release of dual-core Tegra2 phones, Android has had a clear hardware/price advantage over Apple at the top, middle and bottom of the smartphone market. If iPhone 5 is really delayed till fall it's unclear if they'll ever match the top-end phone in hardware terms again.

I don't know if that passes your test of being better "in any way that consumers actually care about", but I will note that they've been collectively outselling Apple for over a year now.


Android has only been outselling Apple if you do not count iPod touches and iPads.


The real thought here, I think, is that adoption drives hardware improvement -- only if you're selling a hojillion chips can you make them cheap, good, and profitable. From this perspective, what you'd want to say is that large market share advantages are extremely defensible and can let you crush the little guys (which apple was through the 90's). But how do you get there in the first place?

The analogy between android/iOS and windows/mac I think has to be well-taken, but most discussions (including this one) leave out the most important difference. Windows got to sell a hojillion units by being the best at selling to business. You buy multi-thousand-dollar machines for all your employees because you expect productivity increases; you don't worry too hard about whether they like the machines or not. The decision maker buys on specs and price if it's not just a salesforce versus salesforce game (a likely win for the open platform because there are more players behind it).

The current generation of mobile, however, is a consumer phenomenon. Businesses aren't buying modern smartphones for their employees -- they're hooking the employees' phones into their networks. Adoption is not driven by purchasing managers but by consumers and therefore by user experience, consumer marketing, branding, etc. in addition to specs and price. This puts the open platform with the worse user experience for the average user at a big disadvantage, particularly if the price differential isn't that large in absolute dollars, which it isn't by comparison with the computers of the 90's (the gap between comparably-specced PC's and mac's being enough to buy multiple smartphones).

I don't know that it makes sense to think of any platform being as strong a winner as windows was; the very presence in the market of a company eager to use an operating system as a loss leader means that android will probably never shrink as small as apple did. However, Apple's advantages in design and branding play to the challenges of the mobile market in a way that they simply didn't for PCs. To this, add the scale advantage Apple currently enjoys (as monopsony buyer of flash memory and LCD's) that locks in big profits that competitors can't touch and it seems quite clear which way the playing field is tilted.

tl;dr: windows won by owning the business market; mobile plays to apple's strengths in a way PC's never have.


So consoles are basically killing off PC gaming

The whole "PC gaming is dead" adage has been repeated for years now, but is simply not true. These are figures for the US, where console gaming is bigger than everywhere except Japan: http://www.gamesetwatch.com/newzoo_2010spend.jpg

As you can see, traditional non-MMO, non-casual PC gaming adds up to 19%, while all consoles put together (Xbox, PS3, Wii, DS, PSP) add up to 43%, so it is very likely that PC gaming is bigger than any single console. Other places like Europe probably have PC gaming bigger than all consoles combined. And even more importantly, console game sales have declined while PC game sales have jumped up.

edit: of course, I'm biased here -- I think stuff like paying to play peer-to-peer and console makers using that money to pay for timed exclusivity is what will destroy gaming as a whole. I'm also philosophically inclined towards open systems rather than closed ones.


Ok, so you want to look at a market share snapshot?

By that argument, Nokia and RIM are going gangbusters in the phone market and have a bright future ahead of them.


No, I want to look at market share trends. By which argument, PC gaming is (slowly) killing off consoles.


Yup, even more so since we're not even sure new consoles are even going to come out.

Have you heard about Microsoft's plans for the next XBox? Or Sony's next generation PlayStation?

Exactly. Nothing.

Games are pretty profitable on consoles, but makers of these consoles usually lose hundreds of millions of dollars over several years before they can even bring a console to market, and then they need to hope that this console will be successful enough to recoup the R&D.

No wonder even rich and successful companies such as Microsoft and Sony are just a few steps away from giving up on creating consoles completely.


Also look at employment trends. More indies, more digital distribution, social, web and mobile game companies. The AAA studios are known to be fragile, risky operations, and the smaller retail-oriented studios(whether PC or console) have mostly disappeared, with the exception of a few making low-end shovelware.


No, it's not just marketshare, it's the first derivative of the marketshare too. Nokia and RIM are slipping, while PC gaming is growing and console gaming is shrinking. And remember that since PC game sales are mostly digital now, the amount that publishers actually receive on selling a PC game is much higher (70%) than on console sales (~30-50%).


"I am from Perth, Western Australia but currently live in New York City and work for Google."

we've got a live one!


IMHO -

Apple's advantage is design. Google's advantage is search.

As the boundaries of mobile search are pushed (better local, better social, voice search, better x), I believe Google will dominate mobile. Good mobile design will become ubiquitous, but search is a different story.

Google has the best search technology (along with the best infrastructure and data to support it). They also have the best ad network to monetize its benefits.


It's not very insightful to realize that Apple has design while Google has search. This is obvious.

Design won't become ubiquitous. Where else has this happened in the world? Design is hard. Great design is incredibly difficult to achieve. What Apple's managed to do is create a great design and then make it a priority all the way through the company. They won't ship a product if the design isn't exactly what they want.

Building a search infrastructure is expensive, but relatively trivial.

I disagree completely in your assertion that design will become ubiquitous.


You're right, great design is incredibly difficult to achieve - the first time. But then it gets copied by numerous competitors. That's happening right now with the iPad.


> Good mobile design will become ubiquitous, but search is a different story.

That's one hell of an assertion. As most of the "iPod killers" showed, design isn't something you can just suddenly decide as a company to start doing right.

Good design hasn't become ubiquitous on the desktop. I find it hard to believe mobile is going to magically do the opposite.


In design and usability, (iOS & Android) >>>> Feature phone.

So for most people in the world moving from feature phones to Android is going to be a huge leap forward. The difference between iOS & Android is a rounding error in this comparison.

A HTC Wildfire @ USD 250 is equivalent to an iPhone4 @ USD 600 for someone upgrading from a Nokia 1100!!

Android is allowing different manufacturers to offer phones at wildly different form factors & functionalities and most importantly price!

Apple is focused on the niche high end market where they can make maximum margin.


Mr. Wilson's numbers leave out some key realities about Android as it stands as a smartphone platform.

First of all, Android is much harder to develop for than the iPhone. This is because the Android ecosystem is so dispersed. There are many more phones, many more os versions, and many more carriers to support. For a resource-strapped application team, iOS is a simpler choice and a quicker win.

Also, there is, what I would say, less of an app culture amongst Android users than iPhone users. I think this because I develop and work on a team that develops native apps for both platforms as well as a cross platform mobile web app. Our iPhone app does about 50 times better (in each category -- downloads, usage, and revenue) than our Android app without exaggeration. Part of this, to be honest, is our iPhone app is better, and that is partly because of my first point. Even in our mobile web app, though, we see about twice as many iPhone users.

Now, I'm glossing over a whole slew of details here, but the net takeaway for me is, if I were a start-up looking to make a dent in the smartphone market, I'd start with iPhone.


First of all, Android is much harder to develop for than the iPhone.

As someone who's published apps on both platforms, I'll disagree with that. For me the occasional extra effort it takes to support multiple resolutions and OS versions is more than made up for by being able to use a semi-modern language. (Preemptive response: Yes, I know Objective-C well, and non-enterprisey Java beats it hands down).


Do you also know Cocoa Touch well? Even if I prefer Obj-C compared to Java, it's Apple APIs where the real beauty is.


Well maybe it was my mistake to generalize (and say "much"). And by develop, I meant develop, test, support, and maintain over a wide range of phones and capabilities. These issues may be more or less pronounced based on what the app does and the size of the user base.


The Microsoft-Nokia deal has yet to have an effect on the marketplace. Nokia will take WP7 international, and that will be bigger than the Verizon iPhone.


What effect do you predict?


I'm not quite sure how the numbers Fred shows prove his point. Android has a larger market share, but it's only been one month since the Verizon iPhone launched. It's entirely probable that had it not launched, Android would have a significantly larger market share. Likewise, it's possible that given another three months, Android's share will reduce even farther. The only thing the numbers prove is that the Verizon iPhone was not a magic bullet that killed Android immediately on launch, but nobody expected that. (I don't actually expect Android's market share to decrease in the coming months either, but my point is that the numbers aren't very useful right now.)


I could give a crap how much market share of people who don't buy anything google captures. If you are making free ad supported apps I'm sure android will be better if you're expecting people to buy your app just avoid it all together.


I'd be interested to know what percent of those Android phones have the Android Market installed and how many have multiple or a competing application store.


Hardly any Android phones don't come with the Market--in fact, the only ones I've heard of that don't are China Telecom's oPhone ecosystem. Plenty of Android tablets don't have the Market.


I just got a cheap android smartphone for the equivalent of $100. I was afraid it might be crappy but I'm delighted with it. It has resistive rather than capacitative touch which aparently is not as good but you then don't miss what you never had. Imo the market works great though I've only downloaded freebie apps so far, chess, sudoku, google sky map. Glad I didn't fork out 5 times as much on an iphone. Google have done me a big favour


I love Google Sky Map. I particularly enjoy pointing it at the ground and seeing stars from the Southern Hemisphere.


I must try that!


What phone is it?


huawei 845


Thanks. It doesn't quite match what I'm looking for, but good to hear a vote of confidence in the basic lower end of Android.


A lot of us had a good laugh when people said the global android phenomenon would could to a halt because of the Verizon iPhone.

My opinion on why the iPad will suffer the same fate: http://martin.drashkov.com/2011/03/why-android-tablets-will-...


Do people really believe that Apple wants to dominate the mobile market? It seems wasteful to critique sales comparisons of iOS vs Android when Apple has never shown any signs of making iOS devices a monopoly.




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