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4H and ROTC are many things, but they are not "generic leadership clubs without a specific purpose". Both groups are much more akin to something like the Boy Scouts, as they demand substantial amounts of time and effort, and give achievements for the mastery of specific skills.



I used ROTC as an example of something that was decidedly not a generic leadership club, sorry I didn't make that clear.

My opinion of 4H was based on 10 seconds of skimming their website, but in that time the generic terminology and cheap selling points targeted towards parents were enough to turn my stomach. It's possible that their website is just targeted towards a different audience, but you would have to convince me.

> they demand substantial amounts of time and effort

That doesn't exclude the possibility that they are a generic leadership club. A leadership club that didn't demand time and effort would be entirely fraudulent rather than simply having dubious value.

> and give achievements for the mastery of specific skills.

If it's like the Scouts, I'm tossing it in with "generic leadership club" unless they provide a metric by which I can judge the engagement and independence of an individual within their system.

Part of what I would want to see from an applicant would be personal goals outside of the framework of the institutions surrounding them. The ability of the individual to bend the institution to those goals would then count as the type of leadership I think colleges are after. They want people who will use the resources around them to do interesting things, not people who aim to collect every badge in the pile.

The pollution of the term "leadership" by those seeking to sell educational experiences is regrettable. Got your morse code badge? Not leadership. In charge of a group of kids learning morse code? Possibly leadership, depending on how much initiative you took to go beyond provided materials. Started a morse code club, created a curriculum for newcomers, advertised, handled paperwork / fund acquisition to get materials & go to a morse code contest? Leadership!




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