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PayPal is updating their polity and it is not going to be a user-friendly one. The update is neatly hidden on their website and only accessible to logged-in users.

If you do nothing, there is what PayPal will have you sign:

1) You cannot sue PayPal, you can only go through arbitration. 2) You cannot be part of any class action claim agains PayPal. 3) You can only fight against PP individually.

To opt-out, you have to submit a written letter, via a postal office.

Full PDF copy of the update available here, in case the links breaks - http://sctz.co/c1

I heard PayPal wants to be likable by their customers. This update is certainly not helping the case.




So, FWIW, specifically about your #1, this change also states that PayPal cannot sue you either. It also states that this arbitration, apparently in either direction, will reside in your county: this will not happen if you choose to sue PayPal, as you will both be dragged to Delaware.

In fact, what you often actually want out of such court actions is to get everyone to agree to arbitration, as it will be faster and cheaper: it ends up being common to use continued presence in court to simply ratchet up the fees until the other guy breaks down and agrees to arbitration.

For a normal person, the result of this would then suck: attempting to sue PayPal will be extremely expensive, will involve having lawyers in Delaware (and possibly having to go there yourself), and, best case, is going to end up in arbitration anyway... bothersome enough to just be prohibitive.

Meanwhile, for a normal person, you are dealing with small amounts of money; the result is that you will likely be attempting to use small claims court anyway, and this policy change continues to let you (and not PayPal!) do this. The limit on small claims court in Delaware is one of the highest in the country: $15,000.

That said, I agree that this is pretty crummy: we have our legal system setup the way it is for a reason (although, in practice, it ends up being often quite broken). I am seriously going to consider opting out of this; but, in the end I believe that I may actually just determine it is beneficial for me and accept it.

Also, the change that prevents you from being part of a class action lawsuit sucks (but, /that/ said, class action lawsuits normally involve individual participants getting a few dollars... it is hardly worth it for most people to bother being part of a class action).


How is this any different form all the other companies that adopted the same Anti-Class action policies in the last few months? Whats so special about Paypal compared to Microsoft, Apple, Google, Steam, etc, that we need this posted 5 times in the last two weeks, and also constantly making it out to be so much worse than everyone else. I know everyone loves hating on Paypal but this is kinda stupid.


Well this is different and unsettling: "Calls to You; Mobile Telephone Numbers. Section 1.10 is being updated to state: By providing PayPal a telephone number (including a mobile telephone number), you agree to receive autodialed and prerecorded message calls at that number..."


Automated phone calls to a number you provide is one of the ways that paypal authenticates your identity. Welcome to the internet, where anyone can be anyone!


That or advertisements.


Paypal is pretty evil, but I can't think of a single successful company, ever, who started spamming their own customer's mobiles


Yeah, my sense the user backlash from unsolicited mobile ad spam would even hurt a giant with such heavy engrained web commerce inertia as PayPal.


Verizon does it to me. They're always trying to get me to take in other deals from 3rd parties or themselves.


Credit card companies do this, which is why I no longer have a Discover Card.


Discover started sending unsolicited marketing messages to your mobile phone!?


Haven't looked into the policies of the other companies, but PayPal has gotten a lot of attention recently when folks on HN were complaining about their accounts being randomly closed/frozen by PayPal.

I don't know about you, but if my account was indeed terminated without reason, thus causing my business financial problems (or maybe even failure), I would want to take legal actions.

Mediation may not be the answer, especially when it is you vs. a giant company.


Mediation is completely different from arbitration. Mediators do not pick winners.


You're right. I meant to say 'arbitration'


Announcement at PayPal: https://cms.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/?cmd=_render-content&c...

kirillzubovsky's PDF without going through the 'Scoutzie' link-shortener: https://www.dropbox.com/s/65b04pv792mejb9/Amendment%20to%20t...




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