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One of the very best things you could do for your cause is to tone down your rhetoric. You're driving far more people away than you're convincing of anything.

There's no shortage of things to criticize Trump for that are clear and hard to argue against. What you're saying is only fuel for the extreme to become more extreme.



I'm personally ok with such rhetoric when the stakes are high (I am losing hope that "talking nicely/sweetly" to people is _actually_ beneficial, on net), though I think yeh the parent comment could do with more material insight.


I think you're missing the GP's point. It's when the stakes are high that the rhetoric being reasonable is even more important, thus you should care more during those times. If you disagree with them that's ok, but your comment just reads like you're trying to explain why it's ok instead of engaging on the GP comment.


Sorry, my sarcasm got a bit too far.


I think yostrovs was talking about Musk, not Trump. And calling someone who did two Nazi salutes in front of a crowd “Hitler” is maybe not as unfair as you are making it out to be. My guess is that Musk did it for outrage purposes rather than because he is an actual Nazi, but it’s hard to know really.

Video in case you somehow have not seen the incident I am referring to: https://youtu.be/gDkuwRx14hQ


If the live audience was outraged by his Nazi salutes, I wouldn’t care so much.

The fact he did two Nazi salutes to an applauding audience with smiles is deeply concerning.


Why would the video you shared take out the words "from my heart" that were said just before the gesture? Would that maybe change the meaning of the gesture? This is the problem with MSM that makes you actually think you're dealing with Hitler.


I agree that the video I shared should have included those words. But the words do not change the meaning of the gesture, which is very uniquely recognizable and important historically. Doing this gesture during WW2 in the U.S. would’ve led to Elon getting arrested at a minimum, or maybe just shot on the spot based on what I know of this time period. (I would love to hear the opinions of actual historians though.)

Then Elon did not apologize or make any attempt to explain it away, and in fact made jokes about it.

Imagine that you were a neo-Nazi. Would you take this gesture and his lack of apology as a sign that Elon is on your side?

This is also not the first time that Elon has done something like this. His Twitter history is not something I would be proud of.

Anybody who thinks it was accidental seems extremely gullible to me. Nobody does a Nazi salute by accident. A “my heart goes out to you” gesture looks absolutely nothing like this gesture for normal folks.


So he did Hitler Gruß from his heart? How am I to interpret that, except even more negatively?

Fact is, one does not simply do a Hitler Gruß without being either extremely dumb or intentionally doing it. Maybe he is both. Nevertheless the influence he has and normalizing this kind of action are scary.




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