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> That's news to me

See, this is the problem. Actually, serious policies (meaning, more serious than "drill baby drill" or "build a wall") are long, complicated, and boring. They don't fit neatly into a soundbite or a chant at a rally, so people who don't have the temperament or capacity to seek out and read such documents think the policies don't exist.

In seriousness, the solution is that Democrats need to be better at messaging by crafting policies that are understandable to their audience.



No, the problem is the medias (and campaign strategists) didn’t even try to communicate on these policies, and again thought social progressivism alone would do. That worked for a time in the early 2010s but they have yet to realize that when there are economic troubles it’s not enough to win elections, as this vote demographics show. No need to insult the intellectual capacity of the other camp.


It's not an insult, and I wasn't addressing either "camp." It's an observation that most people don't have the interest or ability in understanding government policy, and there isn't a good way to communicate the facts of the matter in a way that's accessible to most people. This is a problem of the media, who want everything broken into 30-second sound bites; but of course the media don't exist in a vacuum: they serve the media consumer, who won't listen to anything longer than 30 seconds, which unfortunately isn't enough time to explain the relationship between tariffs and inflation.

Voters demand simple explanations for complex realities, and simple solutions to complex problems, and as a result, the successful politician must fabricate simple explanations and simple solutions, even if they're wrong.


But Democrats gave simple explanations: “Joe is the sharpest he has ever been, the economy is the best you experienced your grocery bill increase is in your mind, no need to hold primaries and have your opinion we know this candidate is the best, etc… and if you disagree with any of this your are not smart enough”. I’m harsh but as a non American leaning left economically I found myself in disagreement many times this pas year but any criticism was met with huge suspicion.


Sure, there were many mistakes made by the Democrats' campaign. In your examples, the problem is not that the explanations are simple, but rather that they are obviously wrong.

EDIT: For fun, let's contrast the attitude of each campaign to its detractors. The Democrats say that people who oppose their strategies are dumb. The Republicans say that people who oppose their strategies are Communist pedophiles who want to destroy America.


Amazing the cognitive dissonance.

Democrats say that people who oppose their strategies are racist, sexist, xenophobic, dumb, fascist, nazi, you name it.

Republicans say that people who oppose their strategies are racist, sexist, xenophobic, dumb, fascist, and nazi.


> Democrats say that people who oppose their strategies are racist, sexist, xenophobic, dumb, fascist, nazi, you name it.

> Republicans say that people who oppose their strategies are racist, sexist, xenophobic, dumb, fascist, and nazi.

Only one of their statements is accurate. Not all opinions are equally valid.


I don’t disagree, but regarding your edit I’m not saying Republicans are not (way) worse, but that I’m hugely disappointed at Democrats. My hope was that instead of taking inspiration from Republicans they would lead an other way.


> My hope was that instead of taking inspiration from Republicans they would lead an other way.

Me too. The Democrats need a better story, a narrative that people can engage with emotionally.


What many heard the Democrats say was that if you oppose their policies you're not only dumb, you're also a racist, misogynist, fascist, nazi, and a threat to democracy.


That was never said.

What was said, repeatedly, is that _Trump_ is a racist, misogynist, has fascist and nazi tendencies, and is a threat to democracy. All of which is true. Ask his former chief of staff.

I disagree with most GOP policies, but don't have an issue with people voting Republican -- I would have been okay with someone like Romney or McCain as president; I could probably even handle pre-MAGA DeSantis (wouldn't be happy but whatever, we'll live). But if people are voting for _Trump_ specifically, then either they hold the same values as Trump, or they're willing to sell out their values for a promise of cheap gas (that they aren't even going to get!). Either way it's pretty bad.


Multiple people on my social networks were saying something along the lines of "If you are voting for Trump, unfriend me because you're dead to me and I don't even want to talk to you about it." Notably I didn't see anything like this coming from the Trump fans. This is because those who have remained inside the Democratic Party have become so indoctrinated that the opinions of the Progressive Left are factual that they now see this as not disagreements, but a religious war. And they're coming unglued now this week because they used to believe that having the popular vote on their side for years meant that their Correct Side was being oppressed because of a malfunctioning democracy. This week, suddenly they have to either admit that they don't really care about democracy as much as their pet ideologies, or that their ideas are radical and unpopular because they're bad.


I'm glad that your conservative friends are so tolerant, but mine aren't. Plenty of conservatives have no problem calling liberals Satanist, anti-American, pedophiles. Just look around.

It didn't used to be like this. The tone of politics changed when name-calling, bullying, and hate became part of campaigning. The country is divided, and the source of the vitriol is one man.


The source is most certainly not just one man. Go listen to recordings of Rush Limbaugh. Or the parody at the start of Hackers. The party has been stoking this blind populist destructive rage for decades, and then channeling the frustration into support for their establishment candidates. Their monster got loose, they got Trump, and now we've got Trump.

As for the larger social relations context, this link posted elsewhere in the thread nailed it for me: https://thedispatch.com/newsletter/boilingfrogs/liberal-tear... (Excuse the crapwall, it doesn't seem to show up with javascript disabled). I will likely ghost everyone that is openly cheering for this. I'm just not capable of entertaining the gloating over populist destruction at this time. Perhaps in six months or a few years I will be able to forgive what they have done.

For context, I'm libertarian. I own a compact tractor and burn cordwood for primary heat. I find much of the overbearing "woke mob" tedious, and internally roll my eyes when I hear things like parents talking about how their kid is trying out a new pronoun every week. But the left would never have been capable of damaging the very bedrock of our society the way that so-called conservatives throwing their own principles into the trash has.


You may be among the extremely tiny minority of sane people left in this country.


Thank you. I try. It certainly doesn't feel like I'm sane, especially this week.

I had a realization yesterday. This is just like someone close to you dying. The sudden unassailable loss. Walking around in a dazed brain fog going through the motions and not even knowing why. Things are now just different, and will never go back to how they were. But it made me realize that I myself will recover in spite of that, and this put me more at peace.


Trump AG hopeful says he wants to drag Democrats’ ‘political dead bodies through the streets and burn them’

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic...


> now see this as not disagreements, but a religious war

Your mind is detaching from reality.

MAGA policies directly hurt some people. Let me say that again. MAGA policies DIRECTLY hurt some people.

They're not being your friend because you're conservative, it's because you're supporting policies that will hurt them. Would you be friends with someone who hurts you?

For example, I am a gay man. Conservatives across the country have been trying to undo protections around PrEP under the guise of religious freedom. The true motivation is inciting another HIV epidemic.

I take PrEP. I don't want HIV. I don't want my friends to get HIV. If you vote for these people, you are directly contributing to bodily harm to me and my community. I cannot support you, because that would be self-destructive.

But that's just me. Now look at abortion - many women know people or have themselves, required an abortion. Many have brushed with death. What conservatives propose will DIRECTLY harm them. Trump plans to chase people leaving states for abortions - this will actually, tangibly, directly, harm people!

You don't see this from "trump fans" onto liberals because the left does not propose any policies that will hurt them. If Kamala would've won, nothing bad would happen to conservatives. If we believe Trump, which I do and you should as well, then MANY bad things will happen to leftists. That's the difference.


> MAGA policies directly hurt some people

This is it.

Liberals aren't "offended" by Trump. Liberals don't have a problem with the "way he expresses himself." The problem is with his governance and policies that do real damage to people we care about.

The reason you don't see conservatives being similarly alarmed by liberal policies is because liberal policies don't hurt people.

To saying nothing of what he's done to American democracy. Before the election, there was plenty of hoopla about another stolen election. Then, when Trump won, suddenly that disappeared. What about the mailman carrying hundreds of ballots? Oh, I guess he's okay now. This exposes the hypocrisy at the core of Trump ideology: our election system is horribly broken except when Trump wins. That's not how democracy works and taking that attitude should be immediately disqualifying.


You're saying it right now. The majority don't believe any of that about Trump.


> The majority don't believe any of that about Trump.

No, the majority accept that those are attributes of Trump, and many people positively enjoy them.


I'm saying it about Trump, yes.

Also the majority do believe it about Trump, but they hand wave it away, or just don't care. And, in a minority of cases, they agree and enjoy being able to openly flaunt it. It's no coincidence that I see Confederate and Trump flags on the same properties.

Not too different than the Germans who voted for Hitler -- though in fairness to them, Hitler seemed pretty normal when he was elected, so you can forgive them for not knowing (and once knowing, it was too late). We already know what Trump is, so what's the excuse now?




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