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Your position is "the position of the majority is wrong."

No we don't need to change the system on the basis that it leads to outcomes you want.



> No we don't need to change the system on the basis that it leads to outcomes you want.

I definitely agree with that view. But maybe we could/should change the system on the basis that "the majority does not agree that the system is working".

While measuring that is hard since you would always tend to find that the system is working if it favours the candidate you like; there still is a significant number of people both left and right leaning that agree that the bi partisan winner-takes all voting system is fundamentally broken.

If only for the fact that a president can ben elected by winning less voices than his opponent, thereby showing that some votes are worth more than others.


68% of people say "I often wish there were more political parties to choose from" describes their views either extremely or somewhat well.

Rounding up looks like around 145 million people voted in this election, that's less than half the population of the united states.

Do you have any evidence to support the idea that the current system reflects the "position of the majority"?

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/09/19/how-well-the...


The system that your "we" (US voters) has is flawed (as all voting systems are) in a greater way than variations of ranked voting are.

It's doomed via repeated iterations to fall prey to variations of Hotelling's law - the evolving of two parties seeking to 'capture' the First Past the Post votes of greatest majority while also directly representing the least (non representive two party politics).

This wasn't as the US founders intended, many expressed an extreme distaste for party politics and envisioned a congress with factions in proportion to the views of the greater population that bargained and dealed within themselves to find comprimises acceptable to most via robust debate.

Instead the US has landed in a wasteland of little to no choice for the public at large.

It's a poor system after 400 years of growth, stagnation wasn't seen by the founders as the way of the future, rather expressly as the hallmark of doom and eventual depotism (to Benjiman Franklin at least who was quite explicit on this).


Having read de Tocqueville, Democracy in America (1835) in civics class, I moved to a country which, along the axes which de Tocqueville admires, does even better.

In my experience, a new language takes ~2 years for reasonable acquisition, and a new culture ~5; I don't know about you all, but I'd guess the chances that the US will ameliorate its basic political systems in the next 5 years range between fat, slim, and none.


On the flip side there's a good chance and perhaps coin to be made on some form of siginificant change in the next four.. perhaps the end of elections as they know them?

The least we can ask of elected politicians is they make some effort toward keeping their campaign promises.


I think my position is majority didn't get to express the outcome they wanted. Fair disclosure: not a US citizen so I don't vote




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