Microsoft makes it a pain, but you can still jump through some CLI hoops to use only a local user account to log in to Windows, rather than the cloud-conmected Microsoft account they try to funnel you into. Not logging into a Microsoft account prevents OneDrive from doing anything other than spamming you with notifications about how great it would be if you logged in and started using it. And you can still uninstall OneDrive after every major OS update that brings it back.
The hardest thing is really just creating the media and booting on the key. Once that's done, it's smooth sailing for most user-friendly distro. I swear, I've had my parents install Linux on 50 computers for their school, and they are really non technical.
Or if ordering a new PC you can get one with Windows 11 Pro for a few $$ more, choose the option to domain join (during initial setup) to create a local account, and create user accounts with no Microsoft account.
Makes it easier to do minor little things like drive encryption as well.
There are a surprising number of laptops where getting Pro edition simply isn't an option. Lots of brands no longer offer detailed build-to-order customization and instead only sell online the same three or four configurations per mdel that retailers stock.
You can but it's more expensive ($100 vs $35ish?) and is done through the Microsoft Store and a Microsoft account which is what some people are trying to move away from.
This. Way easier than any CLI workarounds, and pro is very available. Just don't buy your laptop from Best Buy and the likes. Stick to the better product lines. ThinkPad, XPS, Precision, Latitude, EliteBook, ProBook, Surface, etc. almost all come with pro as default or as an available option.
Just stay away from the more consumer oriented product lines
I was trying to install security updates into a ~8 years old laptop the other day. It's been updated to Windows 10 before. The updates were OTA, but after it completed there was no way to log into the local account without logging into a Microsoft account first (while it being connected to Wi-Fi). Here's the kicker, since this still being on the pre-login setup screen, there was no option to disable Wi-Fi either.
I consider myself fairly technically apt and I can google solutions with the best of them, but I gave up after windows 10, they are just data mining everything, being privacy hostile at every turn. I liked windows 10 as far as looks and usability, but eventually I just gave up and went to Mac and I’ve been a linux user as well (at home desktop)for 15+ years so it felt like home anyway. I requested a Mac laptop for work as well, and while I miss out on some resources at work (mostly limited IT support) because of it, it doesn’t hinder my work or get in the way.
Who knows for how much longer this CLI escape hatch will exist though. Maybe at some point MS will implement mandatory online checks into their OS, similar to how some games DRM schemes work. Then you'll only be able to use "offline mode" if you connect to your account every XX days, or subscribe to a business plan for longer durations.
I'm working on a personal Win 11 Pro machine right now using a local account. I never made an online one. Also I wonder if I uninstalled OneDrive over a year ago, because I don't see OneDrive in File Explorer or Task Manager. I've had this laptop for over a year, so OneDrive has never returned in all the updates since.
Yes, you can. I just now downloaded a win11 23H2 iso and installed w11 pro without going outside of the OOBE. Sure, you shouldn't have to click 'domain join instead' etc, but you can absolutely do it without doing anything outside of the OOBE.
I've definitely seen laptops from multiple OEMs with Pro edition pre-installed that still don't offer the local account route without first going through the CLI to bypass. I think the only other route remaining is to just not have any NIC that the installer can recognize.
here are the steps I just used a few minutes ago to use a local account. You can do it without leaving the OOBE, but you shouldn't have to go through so many steps to do it.
Because on Windows, the CLI is used to circumvent the highly smelly patterns that Microsoft puts in your way to force you to act in a way that is financially interesting for them, even though you've paid for their shitty OS already
On Linux, the CLI (in a similar scenario) is used to... install the software. And you can probably use a GUI package manager depending on your distro.
They are different points of contention and I think both of your points are valid - though only really linked via "CLI dickery".
You are correct that MS is being annoying, stupid and pushy and causes me to resort to CLI-dickery/regedit/service-disable/google-what-fucking-tickbox-to-untick-now to make it calm the farm.
Linux doesn't try to mess with my farm. But I only get 80% - 90% of a farm to start with and have to google "How to do/fix [XYZ],[abc] and [123]" and the answer is always CLI dickery. Last night it was "Use Vim to edit [this] file." Great, then I had to google how to use Vim. But wait, I only want to edit a file so use any file editor! But now I need it to run under sudo...
Both OSs have their issues and CLI dickery isn't going away.
But with MS, I paid them so I feel entitled to have expectations as to product behaviour - especially when it keeps trying to change from what I bought.
> Because on Windows, the CLI is used to circumvent the highly smelly patterns
And on Linux you use CLI to investigate why the hell a modern distro (Rocky 9) hangs up if you run anything more complex than a ping. Or just hangs up if you don't touch it at all, just a bit later.
ANd it requires 9 hard resets (thankfully there WAS an option to do them, it wasn't some desktop class machine an ocean away) and digging and digging what is exactly happening, why it happens and what magik incantations needs to be CLI'ed on this exact version of the distro, because other versions are reporting what everything is correct... yet the machine still hangs.
Source: just spent 4 hours in CLI dickery for that great, stable and unkillable operating system.
But of course, if MS OS - it's 'CLI dickery' but if Linux - then the only time you touch CLI is to 'dnf install magic'
And yes, the real difference is what for the most part you don't need 'CLI dickery' on Windows, so when someone argues for the Linux-like OSes as an a better alternative to Windows it doesn't sounds good.
> ...you can straight up block OneDrive and other cloud functions with Group Policy.
The world has certifiably lost its mind if this or any of the workarounds mentioned by the parent are acceptable to the baseline UX of a major paid OS.
And QuickBooks Enterprise, and CAD, and Windows-only CRM systems, and Windows-only internal financial programs in banks/credit unions, and Windows-only programs in government environments...
It's a lot more than just Office that requires Windows.
Anything I need from ms office I can do with their online apps. They’re good enough for the company I work at and like 99%of other possible places I might work. For my personal stuff markdown and libreoffice are fine
Is there a case where Google Docs or LibreOffice cannot open a docx or pptx correctly?
I haven't used Word or Excel since their '97 version. Even at work I can't remember a situation where I specifically needed the MS implementation.
Google sheets just is no way superior to excel. I’m not even sure how one can say it’s superior. Keynote is fine though. My presentations are just pictures and texts. I refuse to do transitions and all that other garbage.
