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> Picking AWS over Google Cloud

I know this is an unpopular opinion but I think google cloud is amazing compared to AWS. I use google cloud run and it works like a dream. I have never found an easier way to get a docker container running in the cloud. The services all have sensible names, there are fewer more important services compared to the mess of AWS services, and the UI is more intuitive. The only downside I have found is the lack of community resulting in fewer tutorials, difficulty finding experienced hires, and fewer third party tools. I recommend trying it. I'd love to get the user base to an even dozen.

The reasoning the author cites is that AWS has more responsive customer service and maybe I am missing out but it would never even occur to me to speak to someone from a cloud provider. They mention having "regular cadence meetings with our AWS account manager" and I am not sure what could be discussed. I must be doing simper stuff.




> "regular cadence meetings with our AWS account manager" and I am not sure what could be discusse.

As being on a number of those calls, its just a bunch of crap where they talk like a scripted bot reading from corporate buzzword bingo card over a slideshow. Their real intention is two fold. To sell you even more AWS complexity/services, and to provide "value" to their person of contact (which is person working in your company).

We're paying north of 500K per year in AWS support (which is a highway robbery), and in return you get a "team" of people supposedly dedicated to you, which sounds good in theory but you get a labirinth of irresponsiblity, stalling and frustration in reality.

So even when you want to reach out to that team you have to first to through L1 support which I'm sure will be replaced by bots soon (and no value will be lost) which is useful in 1 out of 10 cases. Then if you're not satisfied with L1's answer(s), then you try to escalate to your "dedicated" support team, then they schedule a call in three days time, or if that is around Friday, that means Monday etc.

Their goal is to stall so you figure and fix stuff on your own so they shield their own better quality teams. No wonder our top engineers just left all AWS communication and in cases where unavoidable they delegate this to junior people who still think they are getting something in return.


> We're paying north of 500K per year in AWS support (which is a highway robbery), and in return you get a "team" of people supposedly dedicated to you, which sounds good in theory but you get a labirinth of irresponsiblity, stalling and frustration in reality.

I’ve found a lot of the time the issues we run into are self-inflicted. When we call support for these, they have to reverse-engineer everything which takes time.

However when we can pinpoint the issue to AWS services, it has been really helpful to have them on the horn to confirm & help us come up with a fix/workaround. These issues come up more rarely, but are extremely frustrating. Support is almost mandated in these cases.

It’s worth mentioning that we operate at a scale where the support cost is a non-issue compared to overall engineering costs. There’s a balance, and we have an internal structure that catches most of the first type of issue nowadays.


What questions do you even ask?

In my experience all questions I've had for AWS were: 1. Their bugs, which won't be fixed in near future anyway. 2. Their transient failures, that will be fixed anyway soon.

So there's zero value in ever contacting AWS support.


This rings so true from experience it hurts.


This. This is the reality.

I am so tired of the support team having all the real metrics, especially in io and throttling, and not surfacing it to us somehow.

And cadence is really an opportunity for them to sell to you, the parent is completely right.


We are a reasonably large AWS customer and our account manager sends out regular emails with NDA information on what's coming up, we have regular meetings with them about things as wide ranging as database tuning and code development/deployment governance.

They often provide that consulting for free, and we know their biases. There's nothing hidden about the fact that they will push us to use AWS services.

On the other hand, they will also help us optimize those services and save money that is directly measurable.

GCP might have a better API and better "naming" of their services, but the breadth of AWS services, the incorporation of IAM across their services, governance and automation all makes it worth while.

Cloud has come a long way from "it's so easy to spin up a VM/container/lambda".


> There's nothing hidden about the fact that they will push us to use AWS services.

Our account team don't even do that. We use a lot of AWS anyway and they know it, so they're happy to help with competitor offerings and integrating with our existing stack. Their main push on us has been to not waste money.


When I was at AWS, I watched SAs get promoted for saving customers money all the time.

AWS wants happy customers to stick around for a long time, not one month of goosed income


Yep. Pay us less every month and stick around for a long time. Getting low prices makes it really difficult to move away.

If you still decided to move away, and want to take data with you, yeah... there is a cost. Heck there is a cost to delete the data you have with them (like S3 content).

Its a good way to do business.


I can't say the same of the reserved instance team which is genuinely running a protection racket business.


In a previous role I got all of these things from GCP – they ran training for us, gave us early access to some alpha/beta stage products (under NDA), we got direct onboarding from engineers on those, they gave us consulting level support on some things and offered much more of it than we took up.


Fwiw as a medium spend (250k to eventually grow into 1M+ year) GCP customer we had the same deal with product roadmaps shared up-front under NDA etc.

And never did I miss something in GCP that I could find in AWS. Not sure the breadth is adding much compared to a simpler product suite in GCP.


I don’t have as much experience with aws but I do hate gcp. The ui is slow and buggy. The way they want things to authenticate is half baked and only implemented in some libraries and it isn’t always clear what library supports it. The gcloud command line tool regularly just doesn’t work; it just hangs and never times out forcing you to kill it manually wondering if it did anything and you’ll mess something up running it again. The way they update client libraries by running code generation means there’s tons of commits that aren’t relevant to the library you’re actually using. Features are not available across all client libraries. Documentation contradicts itself or contradicts support recommendations. Core services like bigquery lack any emulator or Docker image to facilitate CI or testing without having to setup a separate project you have to pay for.


Oh, friend, you have not known UI pain until you've used portal.azure.com. That piece of junk requires actual page reloads to make any changes show up. That Refresh button is just like the close-door elevator button: it's there for you to blow off steam, but it for damn sure does not DO anything. I have boundless screenshots showing when their own UI actually pops up a dialog saying "ok, I did what you asked but it's not going to show up in the console for 10 minutes so check back later". If you forget to always reload the page, and accidentally click on something that it says exists but doesn't, you get the world's ugliest error message and only by squinting at it do you realize it's just the 404 page rendered as if the world has fallen over

I suspect the team that manages it was OKR-ed into using AJAX but come from a classic ASP background, so don't understand what all this "single page app" fad is all about and hope it blows over one day


Aws refactored their console to use modern wen spa and it is TERRIBLE.

It amazes me a company that makes that much money has such a crappy client.


Yeah this amazes me as well - the AWS web interface does work, but it's pretty low quality.

You'd think a company with 1.5m employees could find half a dozen decent front end developers, but apparently not


I do use azure a bit so I know what you mean. Googles ui is significantly more buggy in Firefox which I use. On chrome/edge it’s a bit better.


aws is even worse yet somehow people love them, maybe because they get to talk to a support "human" to hand-hold them through all the badness


Totally agree, GCP is far easier to work with and get things up and running for how my brain works compared to AWS. Also, GCP name stuff in a way that tells me what it does, AWS name things like a teenage boy trying to be cool.


That's completely opposite to my experience. Do you have any examples of AWS naming that you think is "teenage boy trying to be cool"? I am genuinely curious.


BigQuery - Athena

Pub/Sub - Kinesis

Cloud CDN - CloudFront

Cloud Domains - Route 53

...


Pub/sub is more like SNS or EventBridge Bus to me


Perfect list, also:

Google Cloud Run - Lambda

Sure I get the reference to the underlying algebraic representation of coding but come on, Lambda tells us nothing of what it does.

Products (not brands, products) should be named in a way that means something to the customer afaic.


> Perfect list, also:

> Google Cloud Run - Lambda

ECS is the AWS equivalent of Cloud Run. GCP Cloud Functions are the equivalent of AWS Lambda.

ECS / Cloud Run = managed container service that autoscales

Lambda / Cloud Functions = serverless functions as a service


Thanks for the clarification hadn’t appreciated the difference. Also somewhat reiterates my point which is nice as well


Have you named any successful product?


Yes, named a product and sold over 100,000 units of them. Naming products is hard but not that hard.


I thought you meant API and parameters. Blaming them for product names is weird to me.


It's nice when things do what they say on the tin. That being said, it's hard to build a "brand" when you start out with a generic name.


How many popular products have you named and launched? Naming products is hard to meet both usability and marketing objectives. This has never been as big of a problem for me, as GCPs APIs for example. Those are the true evil. Product names I care little for.


> How many popular products have you named and launched?

One, and you often times only need one.


aws api and param names are stupidly long CamelCased and not even consistent half the time like a leaky abstraction over their underlying implementation


You remember any example? I don't call API directly and usually use CLI/SDK/CDK that work a lot better than gcloud. I did see some inconsistencies between services (e.g. updating params for SQS and SNS) and that could definitely be improved. But honestly, comparing to GCP mess, AWS is ten times better.


why is that?


Why it's weird to blame them for product names? Because their purpose slightly different. I can see where negativity comes from and understand, but product name is a lot less important as consistent API experience. AWS is the best among big players by far, hats off and well-done to their teams and leadership. I hope the others will finally learn and follow.


My issue isn't just with the names themselves but they are emblematic of AWS's overall mentality. They want to have the AWS(TM) solution to X business case while other cloud providers feel more like utilities that give you building blocks. This obviously works for them and many of their customers I just personally don't care for it. It is probably to do with the level of complexity I am working at (*which is not very complex).

Also, I don't think trying to emulate AWS's support and consistent API makes sense as a strategy for other cloud providers. They will never beat AWS at their own game, it is light years ahead. If cloud providers want to survive they need to fill a different niche and try different things.


> while other cloud providers feel more like utilities that give you building blocks.

Idk why you don't see AWS as a utility providing building blocks.

> I don't think trying to emulate AWS's support and consistent API makes sense as a strategy for other cloud providers.

Those are such essential things. It's very hard to imagine prioritising something else and succeeding in anything.


I have had the experience of an AWS account manager helping me by getting something fixed (working at a big client). But more commonly, I think the account manager’s job at AWS or any cloud or SAAS is to create a reality distortion field and distract you from how much they are charging you.


> I think the account manager’s job at AWS or any cloud or SAAS is to create a reality distortion field and distract you from how much they are charging you.

How do they do this jedi mind trick?


Giving discounts on the things that are more commodified, but digging in on areas that are harder to define and compare with competitors. And of course, evaluating your sophistication and lock-in to determine if they have to compete at all.


One way is to charge high prices from the get go, and then proactively contact you, and offer to help to reduce your bill by doing some cloud optimization magic ;)


Maybe your TAM is different, but our regularly do presentations about cost breakdown, future planning and possible reservations. There's nothing distracting there.


AWS enterprise support (basically first line support that you paid for) is actually really really good. they will look at your metrics/logs and share with you solid insights. anything more you can talk to a TAM who can then reach out to relevant engineering teams


I share your thoughts. It looks like an entire article endorsing AWS honestly


Heartily seconded. Also don't forget the docs: Google Cloud docs are generally fairly sane and often even useful, whereas my stomach churns whenever I have to dive into AWS's labyrinth of semi-outdated, nigh-unreadable crap.


To be fair there are lots of GCP docs, but I cannot say they are as good as AWS. Everything is CLI-based, some things are broken or hello-world-useless. Takes time to go through multiple duplicate articles to find anything decent. I have never had this issue with AWS.

GCP SDK docs must be mentioned separately as it's a bizarre auto-generated nonsense. Have you seen them? How can you even say that GCP docs are good after that?


very few things are cli only, most have multiple ways to do things. and they have separate guide reference sections that can easily be found. compared to aws where your best bet is to hope google indexed the right page for them.


> few things are cli only

wdym? As far as I see, it's either CLI or Terraform. GCP SDK is complete garbage, at least for Python compared to AWS boto3. I have personally made web UI for AWS CLI man pages as a fun project and can index everything myself if needed. Googling works fine. If you are not happy with it then ChatGPT is to the rescue. I honestly do not see any problem at all.


We're relatively small GCP users (low six figures) and have monthly cadence meetings with our Google account manager. They're very accommodating, and will help with contacts, events and marketing.


> I have never found an easier way to get a docker container running in the cloud

I don't have a ton of Azure or cloud experience but I run an Unraid server locally which has a decent Docker gui.

Getting a docker container running in Azure is so complicated. I gave up after an hour of poking around.


Azure is a complete disaster, deserves its own garbage-category, and gives people PTSD. I don't think AWS/CGP should ever be compared to it at all.


Funnily enough, I have the opposite opinion.

AWS has "fun" features like the ability to just lose track of some resource and still be billed for it. It's in here... somewhere. Not sure which region or account. I'll find it one day.

GCP is made by Google, also known as children that forgot to take their ADHD medication. Any minute now they'll just casually announce that they're cancelling the cloud because they're bored of it.

Azure is the only one I've seen with a sane management interface, where you can actually see everything everywhere all at once. Search, filter, query-across-resources, etc... all work reasonably well.


I am yet to meet an IRL person who believes Azure has "sane management interface". In my experience it was horribly inconvenient, filled with weird anti-UX solutions that were completely unnecessary. It maybe shows you all at once, or at least tries to, but it's such a horrible idea for a complex system. Non-surprisingly it never worked properly with various widgets hanging or erroring-out. It was impossible to see wtf is going on, what state it is in, or how to do anything about it. Azure will always be an example of a web UI done horribly wrong. This does actually not surprise me at all since Microsoft products are known for this. Every time I need to extend my kids Xbox subscriptions I have to pull my hair out to figure out how to do it in their web mess.

How can you even compare it to AWS is a mystery to me. There are pages showing all your resources, not sure why you think it's a problem. Could be a problem from long time ago?


you're lucky if azure works without errors half the time...


Oh I disagree - we migrated from azure to AWS, and running a container on Fargate is significantly more work than Azure Container Apps [0]. Container Apps was basically "here's a container, now go".

[0] https://azure.microsoft.com/en-gb/products/container-apps


Heh, your comment almost echos the positive thing I was going to say, as well as highlighting half of why I loathe Azure with every fiber of my being

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/container-instances/... is the one I was going to plug, because coming from a kubernetes background it seems to damn near be the PodSpec and thus both expresses a lot of my needs and also is very familiar https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/templates/microsoft....

Your link does seem to be a lot more "container, plus all the surrounding stuff" in line with the "apps" part, whereas mine more closely matches my actual experience of what you said: container, go

The "what the fucking hell is wrong with you people?" part is that their naming is just all over the place, and changes constantly, and is almost designed to be misleading in any sane conversation. I quite literally couldn't have guessed whether Container Apps was a prior name of Container Instances, a super set of it, subset, other? And one will observe that while I said Container Instances, and the URL says Container Instances, the ARM is Container Groups. Are they the same? different? old? who fucking knows. It's horrific


Oh yeah. This and resource groups are the only two things that azure did well. Everything else is a disaster.


GCP support is atrocious. I've worked at one of their largest clients and we literally had to get executives into the loop (on both sides) to get things done sometimes. Multiple times they broke some functionality we depended on (one time they fixed it weeks later except it was still broken) or gave us bad advice that cost a lot of money (which they at least refunded if we did all the paperwork to document it). It was so bad that my team viewed even contacting GCP as an impediment and distraction to actually solving a problem they caused.

I also worked at a smaller company using GCP. GCP refused to do a small quota increase (which AWS just does via a web form) unless I got on a call with my sales representative and listened to a 30 minute upsell pitch.


If you are big enough to have regular meetings with AWS you are big enough to have meetings with GCP.

I’ve had technicians at both GCP and Azure debug code and spend hours on developing services.


> I’ve had technicians at both GCP and Azure debug code and spend hours on developing services.

Almost every time Google pulled in a specialist engineer working on a service/product we had issues with it was very very clear the engineer had no desire to be on that call or to help us. In other words they'd get no benefit from helping us and it was taking away from things that would help their career at Google. Sometimes they didn't even show up to the first call and only did to the second after an escalation up the management chain.


> I have never found an easier way to get a docker container running in the cloud

We started using Azure Container Apps (ACA) and it seems simple enough.

Create ACA, point to GitHub repo, it runs.

Push an update to GitHub and it redeploys.


Azure Container Apps (ACA) and AWS AppRunner are also heavily "inspired" by Google Cloud Run.


So?


Also much prefer GCP but gotta say their support is hot steaming **. I wasted so much time for absolutely nothing with them.


GCP's SDK and documentation is a mess compared to AWS. And looking at the source code I don't see how it can get better any time soon. AWS seems to have proper design in mind and uses less abstractions giving you freedom to build what you need. AWS CDK is great for IAC.

The only weird part I experienced with AWS is their SNS API. Maybe due to legacy reasons, but what a bizarre mess when you try doing it cross-account. This one is odd.

I have been trying GCP for a while and DevX was horrible. The only part that more-or-less works is CLI but the naming there is inconsistent and not as well-done as in AWS. But it's relative and subjective, so I guess someone likes it. I have experienced GCP official guides that broken, untested or utterly braindead hello-world-useless. And also they are numerous and spread so it takes time to find anything decent.

No dark mode is an extra punch. Seriously. Tried to make it myself with an extension but their page is Angular hell of millions embedded divs. No thank you.

And since you mentioned Cloud Run -- it takes 3 seconds to deploy a Lambda version in AWS and a minute or more for GCP Could Function.




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