Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

I actually prototyped a system like this, mostly as an exercise to learn about crypto. You can't feasibly host or verify proofs on-chain, so you need external trusted verifiers (e.g. oracles). Making sure the oracles can't front-run proof submission is a challenge. Standard formal proof system (like Lean) are sufficiently expressive, although they weren't built for this and need to be modified to make sure a proof hasn't introduced any additional axioms, as you note. The proof system also becomes a point of attack, so you'd probably want multiple, independent verifiers (which themselves have been formally proved correct). I believe these exist for some proof systems, although I'm not sure about Lean's kernel.

Ultimately, I don't think this is really practical, and investing in AI proof agents is the way to go.



> You can't feasibly host or verify proofs on-chain

I came to the same conclusion with existing systems, full on-chain verification would not be economically feasible.

But perhaps a special-purpose chain specifically made for this may not have the same limitations. Or Truebit-like oracle systems may be possible, where external verifiers can dispute other external verifier's assertions of correctness by running only the (potentially) wrong steps on-chain.

The frontrunning may be avoided by submitting hash(accountid | secret large random number | proof) first, then once that's finalized the full proof with the random number. The random number so the proof can't be brute forced from the hash. Payouts have some reasonable delay so if someone tries to frontrun the second step by intercepting the full proof and submits both steps (possibly with a varied proof) before the second step of the first person is finalized, the first person can still prove with a reference to their first step and their working proof that they were first. This still requires some thought regarding (forced) congestion in relation to the transaction cost and bounty size.

Metamath has the same problem of the system accepting new axioms anywhere, and the same $a statement being used for definitions. I have some hopes for Metamath Zero (https://github.com/digama0/mm0), which is a related system which may be able to fix this.

I think this idea is rather synergistic with proof agents. I think more people would consider developing these if enough bounties were credibly committed. It might speed up and greatly increase the number of formalized proofs.


Chainlink has solved this. Worth taking a look if you're still interested in this sort of thing.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: