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Do you have firebrick? (hightempinc.net)
41 points by walterbell on Nov 21, 2022 | hide | past | favorite | 22 comments



There's another kind of hard firebrick, called "high alumina", which is used in soda and salt wood-firing pottery. The alumina content resists the sodium oxide from the salt or soda decomposing in the wood fire.

It's on my todo list one day to build a wood fire kiln out of "splits" of high alumina on the inside and 2800 rated IFB on the outside, to do my own soda firing. IFB absorbs water so it has to be protected from the elements with a roof and walls, but it's worth it given how much efficiency you gain.

There's an interesting playlist of videos about wood fired kilns for pottery here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_wVFkKwCmg&list=PLS6Mrdpt53...


Building a groundhog is on my bucket list but firing them is such an insane amount of work that I should probably opt for something smaller.


I'm thinking about building a wood fired kiln that uses wood pellets for the fuel. As long as you know the rate you want them fed at, and keep the hopper full, the level of effort is substantially lower. I know there exist wood pellet kilns, but the ones I've seen are prototypes at a higher level of sophistication than "an auger that dumps pellets in a hole at a particular RPM"


And here was me expecting an article about https://firebrick.co.uk/


Heh...as an A&A customer I was thinking that too, then wondering if someone had found a vulnerability in RevK's code.


One thing that's notable is that an insulator for high temperatures (eg. Soft fire brick) is very different from an insulator for low temperatures (eg. Your freezer).

High temperature stuff might get 0.3 W/mK.

Low temperature stuff, for example polyurethane foam used in fridges, are 0.02 W/mK - 10x better!

If someone can invent a high temperature insulator that is as good as low temperature insulators, then that could translate to lots of saved energy.


Silica aerogels have a pressure-dependent thermal conductivity, and at atmospheric pressure it is approximately 0.03 W/mK – there are pictures of them on bunsen burners with ice-cream or flowers on top. Their "naked" density is on the order of 2 kg/m^3 -- comparable to that of air (~1 kg/m^3), as they are, unsurprisingly, mostly air. The melting point is around 1400 K (either not as high or comparable to the "2200 degrees" mentioned in the article – I'm unsure if that's ºC or ºF).

The down side, of course, is the cost: all the "real" providers I can find have a price of "contact us", and on Amazon a ~35x25 cm^2 panel goes for about €30, in comparison to somewhere between half and a tenth the price for bricks or other forms of insulation...

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerogel#Silica_aerogel


Such things exist but are incredibly expensive.

For example, I can't remember where I saw it (some show I saw like 20 years ago), but some really expensive industrial process has a vacuum sealed double walled vessel. Basically, a Hydroflask shaped like an oven. It had low thermal conductivity, but the hard part was keeping the thermal expansion from cracking it open.


It’s now a regular commercial thing known as vacuum insulated panels. They are of course, expensive, and damage makes them useless.


>If someone can invent a high temperature insulator that is as good as low temperature insulators, then that could translate to lots of saved energy.

I'm really not sure these are up to the task, but you can make them thicker as they are cheap.

Here's a carbon foam process from AvE [1] [2]

Also, if you only need one time use, there's StarLite [3] Which is a composite of Elmers Glue (PVA), Baking Soda and Corn Starch. Commercially, intumescent[4] materials are available that are essentially a one time use fire repellant paint.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wex_yKfrTo4

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-qOIO6IQWk

[3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IbWampaEcM

[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intumescent


Remember those little white tiles on the outside of NASA's Space Shuttle?

I don't have W/mK data...but cost and durability might be issues.


Apparently the conductivity of the tiles is-

0.028 BTU/ft-hr-°F at 70°F and 1 atm

0.073 BTU/ft-hr-°F at 2000°F and 10^-4 atm

Not sure how that translates to SI units though. So many conversions!

Edit:

0.048 W m^-1 K^-1 at 21°C, 1 bar

0.126 W m^-1 K^-1 at 1093°C, 0.0001 bar


That was helpful. I want to build a gas forge but I want to avoid ceramic fiber. I am grateful for any hints.


I've built a few coal forges. My insulating material tends to be a mixture of 2:3 plaster of paris to fine quartz sand. I bought the sand from a pool/aquarium supply store.

It holds up well to the heat, but not so much the rain. I tend to remake it every 1-2 years. When it's time I crush up the old bits into a new mix so it doesn't take much more material.


That's awesome!

Does that get hot enough to melt aluminum?


I'd be surprised if it doesn't. You can melt aluminum with a handful of charcoal briquets in a terracotta pot!


Oh really? I think the ball of aluminum foil in my junk pile is about to meet its fate. Cheers


Yeah certainly. If it's reasonably enclosed you can easily melt steel.


Wow! Cheers!


If you want to avoid them for health reasons, there are types of ceramic fiber that can be dissolved by the body (water + mild acid), but they will take slightly less heat, and you'd have to protect them from, obviously, water and acids.

edit: I'd still suggest to enclose them and wear a mask while working with them, but IMHO them being dissolvable makes them much less scary, at least to me.


Looks like the website was hugged to death

https://web.archive.org/web/20221120130056/https://hightempi...


Yes I do, all kinds of them.




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