This doesn't control for the fact that the world sucks now, does it? I read a few months ago that ~25% of young adults had thoughts of suicide in the past year, so I think it's safe to say that the causes are more external than internal at this point.
Disentangling pandemic effects from "normal" life is complex but overall in the US suicide rates are actually down for 2020, though slightly increased for younger Americans. The trend in the US was upwards into 2019 so these are positive developments.
It is very difficult to properly assess 2020-2021 survey data both because the "you should be depressed" messaging is very strong in the media and the bias in who responds to surveys is complicated by the pandemic.
I am a Canadian and we saw an enormous drop in suicides, 30+%, in 2020 despite survey data (and wacky conspiracies) to the contrary.
I don't think it is "safe to say" much of anything about suicide rates or individual motivations, it is a complex issue.
> the bias in who responds to surveys is complicated by the pandemic.
Many people have lost family members and been pushed into poverty. It is incredibly callous to think mental health can be discretely measured without accounting for the environment.
Suicide is not a quantitative measure of mental health.
If the claim that "Suicide is not a quantitative measure of mental health" means that such large fluctuations in the suicide numbers across many jurisdictions with differing underlying rates can't be used to inform any opinions about the impacts of the pandemic on mental health then I emphatically disagree.
I don't know who said you can measure mental health without accounting for the environment, I never made that claim! I literally said "I don't think it is "safe to say" much of anything about suicide rates or individual motivations, it is a complex issue."
It's probably more likely that the internet is amplifying every problem in the world and since young adults grew up with it, it's more integral to their lives.
Additionally, there seems to be a stigma attached to not caring about a particular event, especially if doesn't affect you, all because of the slippery slope argument which is a fallacy.
> This doesn't control for the fact that the world sucks now, does it? I read a few months ago that ~25% of young adults had thoughts of suicide in the past year, so I think it's safe to say that the causes are more external than internal at this point.
How did you come to think depressions' cause must be internal ?
I am increasingly confident I suffer from depression, rather than just being generically miserable.
How do you deal with the trust issues posed by that questionnaire? I have suicidal thoughts most days, but I'm concerned that revealing this to an NHS doctor would quickly result in my freedom of choice on what happens next being taken from me. Seems like one of the few cases where US healthcare (where you are explicitly a customer as well as a patient) has some advantages.
Not a doctor but have experienced something like what you're describing. It is important to be open with your doctor about this stuff because it allows them to accelerate getting you help. Differentiating between suicidal thoughts and intentions (the former of which I had, the latter I did not) made me comfortable enough to have the conversation.
Really though, seek help. It is unlikely you'd lose choices (eg be sectioned) if you're asking for help and engaging with that help.
That's a good point - thanks. "Thoughts" rather than "intentions" is definitely more aligned with where I am. Part of the trouble for me and presumably a lot of people is untangling those things - for example, would my thoughts be intentions if not for having a spouse, who I could never imagine hurting in that way by leaving? Moreover, does the mere presence of that kind of "blocker" represent a positive sign?
I pick at this stuff in my own head all the time, and just don't have enough confidence in doctors to believe they could tell me anything new. Being able to skip straight to pharmaceutical or other non-talking solutions via a disclaimer would probably mean a lot more people like me would seek help.
> Being able to skip straight to pharmaceutical or other non-talking solutions via a disclaimer would probably mean a lot more people like me would seek help.
Antidepressants are strong stuff. Some years ago I hit a bit of a snag and went to a doctor and got just this, a prescription after five minutes of talking with helpful advice like "get a girlfriend" or "study something else". Stuff really worked... except in the wrong direction. Not an exception either, common enough they put "suicide" as a side effect in the fine print. I think if you're gonna take something like that you need some kind of feedback/monitoring and test different drugs until you might find something that works right. A hands off fire and forget prescription like I got likely won't work for most people.
Yes, the presence of a blocker like that is a good thing. What ifs aren't the most useful thing though.
GPs have been enormously helpful to me with this stuff. Most are very understanding. If you can do an online appointment booking that might help too - so the immediacy isn't an issue so you can write the appointment reason very clearly and revise it as much as you want before hitting the button. Otherwise, tell the receptionist you'd like a phone appointment (for the distance that gives psychologically) and that it is for a mental health issue. The diagnostic criteria for depression are fairly easy to satisfy - it is mostly about low mood for 4+ weeks. Keep details to a minimum you need to get a prescription but be cooperative if they probe.
Whatever you do though, don't just suffer. Tell your spouse how you feel too. Get some help.
Involuntary admission works the same way in the US.
I have kinda the same problem. I've had depression for a very long time - stable, but consistently declining. I get the "... or I could just kill myself" xapata mentioned a couple times per week and the reasons I don't are basically "that sounds like work" and "that would make my mother sad". Which aren't exactly good reasons, I know, but so far I've done very little actual self-harm and I very much don't want to get involuntarily admitted. I really would like to get help to deal with depression. I've battled it out alone with it for 15+ years and I'm not exactly winning that fight. But- anyone that's qualified to offer that help is pretty much legally required to admit me if I answer their screening questions somewhat truthfully.
The PHQ-9 is a pretty standard depression screening questionnaire that you can complete in a minute or two. https://www.mdcalc.com/phq-9-patient-health-questionnaire-9