You nailed it: THIS is most of the general GUI problem.

"""No one has enough free time to build a brand new high quality app for mumble which works on 3 desktop OSs and 2 mobile."""

It also can't be (whatever windowing kit, E.G. QT) because that requires a big download in addition to the program, and also 'doesn't feel native' or 'doesn't look right' or 'sets off the AV scanner'.

The other escape hatch is electron; which looks "web", but is even _more_ bloated, but at least it doesn't set off the scanners. Instead it just gobbles CPU cycles, memory, and is slow and horrid.

I'm to the point that I don't care what wins, or how horrid writing for it is; I just need a widgets toolkit and bindings that can be developed for ONCE, is hosted with the OS and shared among all apps, and works on Mobile (all of them), Win, OSX, and 'nix.

Electron is what Discord and Teams and Slack use. And Google's stuff just uses web pages.

>The other escape hatch is electron; which looks "web", but is even _more_ bloated, but at least it doesn't set off the scanners. Instead it just gobbles CPU cycles, memory, and is slow and horrid.

I keep wondering if something like Godot could win out in GUI-land. https://medium.com/swlh/what-makes-godot-engine-great-for-ad...

It's the first time I hear of "sets off the AV scanner" being a major problem for native apps. How frequent is it?

If you don’t get the proper certificates for signing your packages, all the time.