As someone who has just remodelled an old house with loads of flatheads: you've got to be kidding me. I hate those things with a passion.
Flathead screws only restrict the movement of the screwdriver in one dimension and allow it to move in the other one. This leads to the screwdriver to keep sliding out when you put force on under even the slightest angle.
Phillips screws improve on this design by restricting movement in two dimensions and force the screwdriver to always be in the center, but they slip easily and wear quickly.
Torx are superior because they fit much more "snugly", though at the (minor) cost of being less forgiving of using the wrong size of screwdriver.
An advantage of flathead is that it is easy to unfoul the screw head. A minute with a utility knife or a flathead screwdriver will clear the channel of dirt or paint. I would not want to deal with a torx that has several layers of paint dried into it.
If I was in charge of these things, I would enact a 'Fahrenheit 451'-style policy, except for Flathead screws instead of books. Any of the other myriad style of screws is preferable to those ancient fasteners.
Agreed. There are two things that I feel should be destroyed and replaced on sight for the betterment of humanity: flat head screws/drivers, and network hubs.
It would probably even cause a measurable increase in lifespan due to removal of a significant stress source. But I can dream...
Everywhere in large/old enterprises. I swear they multiply when nobody's looking, and they tend to cause massive headaches when they're plugged in by the unaware.
Another issue with torx is that the driver has to go in mostly square. Flathead or phillips screws can be turned if there's an obstacle directly behind the screw and you need to put the screwdriver in at a slight angle.
I’m sure you have worked this out but my technique is to scrape all the paint off very carefully, then crack the lock by turning the screw in the wrong direction. Sometimes I hit the screw driver with a hammer too. After the lock is broken, turn the screw the right way.
This way, stripping the head isn’t such a problem as it’s burring off the head in the wrong directions, saving the important edge for actually getting it out.
Yes, I also quickly developed some skill with a utility knife, getting the paint out and creating space for the screwdriver head, but I never found a good way to prevent the screwdriver from sliding sideways. Especially with large screws that require a lot of force to remove.
Heat and then a crack with a hammer have been my method. Always using the absolute tightest getting screw driver. I still snap the screw maybe 1 time in 5 due to the torque I can get on it. I’m repairing rusted out 1940s window hinges, and it’s truest awful. Have got about 100-150 to go, but I’ve done maybe 300.
I use a cheap chisel the same width as flathead screw, thoroughly clean out the slot with it and use as a screwdriver with very heavy pressure as I turn. This was for very old (circa 1900) screws in old growth wood.
You probably have a cheap flathead screwdriver which has tapered edges. They are significantly more expensive, but a good flathead with edges that are square to the screw slot works much better. (I'm not sure if I described that well)
To make them work even better you can burnish a slight edge one the blade which will dig in and stop slippage.
They don't even need to be expensive. I have no clue why these aren't more common, but keep a cheap set of gunsmithing screwdriver bits around. Never seen them in a hardware store, but they are far superior to regular flathead bits with a chisel shape. Or just regrind all your screwdrivers when you buy them, which also makes it really easy to identify which flathead screwdrivers are reserved for hammering/prybar duty.
>I can say I truly don't understand how phillips ever even took hold over flatheads. Cheap phillips head screws seem designed to strip out.
It's not cheap ones; Phillips heads were designed to strip out. It's the very reason they're used.
The whole idea was to use them in factory assembly, so that workers wouldn't overtorque them. You put them in and tighten, and when they cam out, you're done.
If you want a fastener that can be easily removed, and maybe reused several times, Phillips is the wrong choice.
And if you have a torque-limiting screwdriver, as should be common in any modern factory, then Phillips is simply obsolete and unnecessary.
If you design a feature and it doesn't work, you don't get credit for the design. Who wants a screw that will self-destruct when it is correctly torqued? Which, by the way, is a value that widely varies and you can't just design one screw head to limit torque for every situation.
I've had Phillips over-torque and eat threads. I've had them strip to a raw steel crater long before the head even meets the surface it's being screwed into.
Definitely agree that Phillips is obsolete. God I hate them. I may have a problem. I've worked on a lot of old engines in my life and seeing a torn-out cross is like a big middle finger from the previous person who worked on it, usually the manufacturer. An engine is something that deserves an easily removed fastener that is applied with a torque wrench. Who knows how many newton-meters a Phillips head takes before it cams? Does anybody? Probably a huge range.
>I've had Phillips over-torque and eat threads. I've had them strip to a raw steel crater long before the head even meets the surface it's being screwed into.
>Who knows how many newton-meters a Phillips head takes before it cams? Does anybody? Probably a huge range.
Yep, that's the problem with them. Maybe they made sense decades ago when assembling aluminum aircraft and they didn't have widely-available torque-limiting screwdrivers. But now they're ridiculously obsolete, and the only reason we still use them is because of sheer inertia (i.e., everyone has a Phillips-head screwdriver handy, but lots of people do not have a set of Torx drivers at hand; also, the inertia makes them cheap). They should have been retired ages ago. If I were dictator, I'd simply ban them (not allowed in new designs, no new Phillips screws allowed to be sold, but drivers of course are fine for removing old ones to replace with better fasteners). There is simply no good reason to use Phillips now.
> Extensive evidence is lacking for this specific narrative, and the feature is not mentioned in the original patents. However, a 1949 refinement to the original design described in US Patent #2,474,994 describes this feature.
If by flat head you mean “-“ shape then the main reason is that if you don’t have the drill bit centre plain in the exact same plain as the screws then it’s a nightmare to remove. For metal of pre threaded holes this isn’t an issue but drilling into wood where even with a pilot hole you can be a few degrees of perpendicular to the surface flat heads are significantly slower to work with.
Square heads are also acceptable. Kreg uses them for pocket hole screws and I like how easy it is to get the bit in when you're in a tight spot. They resist cam out pretty well also, I've not yet had a screw of either type I couldn't easily remove.
A good flat head screw is better than a crappy Phillips but a bad one is worse. The bad ones seem to strip by design.
No, they don't just seem to: Phillips was specifically designed to cam out. It was invented for this very purpose. When you're cursing with a Phillips screw that's stripped-out, you need to know that the fastener is doing exactly what it was designed to. The problem is people expecting these screws to be easily removable; that was never the intention. And the other problem is people using them for applications where they might want to remove them one day; that again is contrary to the design goal and intended use of the Phillips screw.
"There has long been a popular belief that this was actually a deliberate feature of the design, for the purpose of assembling aluminum aircraft without overtightening the fasteners. Extensive evidence is lacking for this specific narrative, and the feature is not mentioned in the original patents. However, a 1949 refinement to the original design described in US Patent #2,474,994 describes this feature."
My issue with kreg is that the driver isn’t a perfect fit for the screws so when you take them out you have to knock them off the driver tip somehow. It’s like it’s an imperial metric mismatch but they are all official kreg parts so don’t know.
I think that's a feature, not a bug. You can stick the screw on the driver, and even though it's not magnetic, it'll stay on, allowing you to get into a tight space easily one-handed.
You don't really remove pocket hole screws much (though you certainly can with much less cam-out than Phillips head) so it's optimizing for the presumed one-way trip. I would assume anyway.
Almost every time I remove a pocket hole screw it's because I'm trimming something glued up (like a table top) and didn't plan for the saw blade when I put in the screws. Every time I think "heehaaw" and then I do it again the next time.
Do you find yourself stripping Phillips head acres frequently? That is because you are confusing Phillips and Pozidriv heads. They look similar but have a different head and different amount of engagement.
I just bought myself some Wiha drivers after years of using shitty tools. I am so much happier now.
Even using the correct drivers Phillips head screws tend to strip. I have both drivers, and the Pozidriv screws seem to strip quite a lot less frequently than the Phillips. Of course neither strips as rarely as Torx, Allen, or Robinson. Hex bolts are also great.
Phillips screws are design to have the driver leave the socket if it is over-torqued. Frequently people keep going after this has occurred which results in stripped heads, but if you listen to what the tool is trying to tell you then it shouldn't happen.
I’ve mainly had the problem when getting them out. Especially when the application requires thread locking compound and has been out in the field for a few months or years - even when they had been properly torqued with a torque wrench.
We abandoned Phillips and Pozidriv completely and went to Torx for the screws (we were already using hex for bolts). Haven’t really had any issues stripping out screws since.
Even without thread locking compound, if the thing they're stuck in has corroded the screw/bolt or expanded. Phillips shouldn't strip going in, but it sure as hell strips coming out.
Yeah, this is compounded by the fact that our products go into marine environments - all our fasteners are 316 stainless but there are still sometimes galvanic issues.
Stainless fasteners are the worst. My company builds food equipment so they're a necessity, but... ugh. They gall terribly and they're squishy. If there happens to be a burr or crud in the threads, you might as well grab your angle grinder and drill, because that screw is not going to come out any other way.
It's interesting you say that, because I had a good experience with stainless!
I used to use a lot of stainless bolts on machines that went into hostile[1] environments. We used a variety of hex socket bolts, with thread lock compounds and calibrated torgue drivers to put them in and uncalibrated drivers to take them out when they eventually came back for refurb.
We rarely had problems putting them in or taking them out.
I don't know why problems were so rare. I think it being a safety critical industry helped: we bought expensive bolts and tools, and people had some training to use them.
Phillips is incompatible with thread lock assuming you want to take them out. If threadlock is not used the removal torque is actually less than the insertion and it shouldn't be a problem in this case.
They do. Cars are engineered to fail and some models are sold even at loss to get the profit from OEM parts and service. This is also often the reason why seemingly similar parts are incompatible from one model to the next; the manufacturers are racing against the (often much more durable) aftermarket parts. If they were in the business of making cars great for the consumers, they'd engineer them strong with grease fittings on every moving joint and have all parts standardized across models and brands, differentiated mostly by car size or such (supercompact vs crossover suv vs heavy-duty truck). This would however result in cars that would be easily maintained to last forever, like some old work equipment is and that'd be bad for the planned obsolescence market model of car manufacturers.
And yet, cars still last for two decades or more if maintained properly, and are IMO some of the most reliable pieces of gear out there - I'm finding newer models to be better in that regard than older ones (but maybe that's bias on my side, I haven't driven older cars in a while now)
Yes, if maintained properly, which means swapping out these engineered to fail parts every so often, which becomes uneconomical at least in the resale sense at some point in time, because the repaired car resale value is less than the cost of repair. For instance on VAG cars, the designed to fail cash-cow parts are typically the various suspension bushings. Once such a part is worn out, resulting in a part that has excessive backlash, it'll cause prematurely worn out parts in the rest of the system it's a part of as well.
My daily driver is a 25 year old car that I'm keeping on preventive maintenance. I got it when it was 16 years old and still in pretty good shape since it was barely used and always kept in a warm garage. I've always had pretty old, but well maintained cars in order to minimize the total cost of ownership of them, and kept them running until something too difficult or expensive breaks. I never value them for what I'd get for selling them, because I've never sold a car nor planned to. To me, the car value is always the utility and TCO value of knowing the state of them via preventive maintenance repairs. Usually the failing part not worth fixing is the body, either due to a collision or rust damage.
In addition to always inspecting an used car from underneath, a thing I learned early was to replace all the cash-cow OEM parts with upgraded parts when possible. If not, at least try to have repaired parts made that are improved at the point of failure to be stronger than OEM parts, so that they don't fail the same way again. Factoring the preventive repair into the price of the used car is required in order to be sure to afford owning the car. After that initial preventive repair, it's about checking the parts stay like new, or it becomes very expensive to keep very quickly once something fails after a part's worn out.
Anyhow, look at farm equipment, mine equipment and such to see what vehicles not engineered to fail are constructed like, and I don't mean the extra robustness of the loadbearing parts for the much larger workloads they're designed for.
"which becomes uneconomical at least in the resale sense at some point in time, because the repaired car resale value is less than the cost of repair."
I think this is a common misconception about car repair economics. The question is not whether the repair cost is more than the value of the car, the question is whether the repair cost + sale cost is higher than the value of the repaired car. I like keeping cars that I know the history of, even if the car is worth <$2,000 and the repairs >$1000, because it is unlikely that I can get a $3000 car that I have as much confidence in.
Experience first-hand or via experts who repair them daily, the former can be done by owning the same car or brand for a longer while and spotting the pattern.
Prefer makes that have excellent rust protection and models with relatively low stress configuration engines rather than high performance models. The two latter are usually mechanically the same or mostly the same, but the latter of them receive much larger stresses in use and hence tend to fail earlier.
If you intend to modify the car, prefer older ones, because they have lower regulations, but this depends on the legislative area you are in as well. For instance cars with OBD-II are too new for engine upgrades almost anywhere.
Maybe it's that they don't care. Last transmission I rebuilt (following.factory service manual) had a Phillips fastener with threadlock on it that required destructive removal after careful use of a manual impact driver. Replaced it with a threadlocked Allen fastener.
>I’ve mainly had the problem when getting them out.
Yeah, that's your problem right there. Removing an old Phillips screw will take more (usually much more) torque than it took to install it, so it'll cam out. The problem is that you're trying to get them out. Don't do that. Phillips screws were never designed for removal that way. They were meant to be used for installation only, and to limit torque on installation. If it's been installed with thread-locker, that should be a sign to you that it's never supposed to be removed. If you want a screw that's meant to be removed after years of service, pick something else; Phillips is not designed for this.
Unfortunately, if you're trying to remove a screw after years of service, chances are you weren't the one who originally decided what type of screw head to use.
He's correct about this. Phillips was an early attempt at a one-way fastener. Doesn't mean the manufacturer isn't a dick for using them.
If you're working on something really important, like auto mechanics or the like, consider buying new fasteners when you reach re-assembly. Those old stretched bolts probably need to be freshened up anyway.
>if you listen to what the tool is trying to tell you then it shouldn't happen.
The problem is when the tool is telling you the screw is tight enough but it's only halfway in. Or hasn't come out yet. That's where the stripping happens.
There's a whole set of skills needed. If it's only half way in when it cams out, then you need a bigger pilot hole. If you're screwing into wood, another useful tip is to dip the screws in vaseline (petroleum jelly) first.
If you're getting stuck removing the screw, wait 6 months for the humidity profile to change and the wood to open up.
I'm being slightly factious and I share your pain. The vaseline tip is real though.
Recently, Fender (the electric guitar manufacturer) began offering vintage reissue models with the originally-issued flathead screws, at some point years ago they had switched to Phillips. When doing any kind of modification or repair, I realised after getting one of the vintage models that I preferred flathead for that reason. Phillips is bad on guitars because not only is it easy to strip the head, but you can also end up dinging the top of the guitar when the screwdriver tip dislodges and hits the nice top finish.
This is also why you should only use a hand screwdriver and not a power driven driver bit.
Torx is the way to go. I try to only buy GRK screws now if I can help it. They're more expensive, but it's so much harder to strip them with the star head geometry.
IMHO, the Phillips head is pure evil and persists mostly because it’s one of the best ways to cause consumer-induced early obsolescence in any product that requires assembly by the end-consumer. It’s a huge unspoken conspiracy in the manufacturing world: “You supply Phillips screws. I supply Phillips screws. Everybody supplies Phillips screws. Everybody stays happy (except the consumers).”
“You stripped the screw head because you didn’t apply enough pressure.” O’RLY?
I wish governments would gradually outlaw Phillips. And I predict that the EU will be the pioneers in doing this.
Here in France, I've seen not much Phillips (usually for small appliances or screws in plastic)..
I sent IKEA an email asking them to specify the difference between pozidriv and Phillips in their installation manuals (many people don't know), but they didn't reply :'(
I can only agree, Pozidriv is so much better! I recently bought specifically both philips and pozi head screwdrivers, and Ive generally had both before but it still a hassle to always select the right one.
Pozidriv is the devil. It's impossible to distinguish visually in many cases between Philips and Pozidriv. Just use Torx, Square, or Hex. That way there is no confusion.
It's unfortunate that Ikea doesn't seem to publicize this or provide drive heads with their furniture (AFAIR). I was glad I picked some up before I did a kitchen with Ikea cabinets. It saved me a lot of grief.
I don't think they provide it with their kitchen elements, but for all furniture they provide a hex key for assembly and assume that you have a screw driver yourself.
At all of the nearby hardware stores, there is a wide arrangement of pozidrive screwdrivers. If I recall correctly all of my "cross" bits for the powertool is pozidrive as well. It may not be widely available in the US, but it certainly is here in Denmark.
Pozidrive screwdrivers and bits are readily available in the US but have low cultural awareness; particularly, the indicator that heads require them and not Phillips is not recognized.
Exactly so, 99% of people have never heard of posidriv and don't have the bits, or don't know they have the bits. I couldn't find anywhere in instructions or the website where Ikea mentions that you should use them, but sure enough every screw used posidriv.
"A Phillips bit fits in a Pozidriv screw head, but it will most likely cam out before the fastener is fully tight. This can damage the fastener and is why that cup hinge loosens up so quickly when a Phillips bit is used. A Pozidriv bit does not fit in a Phillips screw."
Yeah, I don't think "that's not phillips, that's pozidrive" is a good excuse. If they're that close, then pozidrive is just a non-standardard-complying phillips bit. It's the IE6 of screw heads, and the confusion is all their own fault.
The Phillips is the IE6 of screw heads. Pozidriv is an improved version which has long since replaced Phillips in Europe. I was unaware that Phillips screw heads were still common in the US until reading this thread.
It seems Phillips is just an outdated but standards-complying head. No one wants to use it because there are better tools for the job these days, but it did serve its purpose once. Whereas Pozidrive just duct-taped a few updates to the old standard and decided to call it good rather than fixing the actual problems.
There's no reason to have kept the same form-factor for the two varieties, it just leads to unnecessary confusion. The fact that you can plug an incorrect driver into it is, by definition, broken. Like how USB and Ethernet jacks are the same size, so you can plug your USB stick into Ethernet (which luckily does nothing harmful) but you can't plug Ethernet into USB.
If you're going to update an old standard and that requires an incompatibility with the old standard, you should come up with an entirely new form factor to ensure people won't mistakenly use the old connector with the new technology.
Though to be honest here in the US I've never seen Pozidrive and I just checked, I have zero drivers for a Pozidrive screw. Phillips really is just that awful all by itself.
It's not like pozidriv screws are unmarked. And in any case these days if you buy 200 screws you get a bit thrown in for free at most places. 100% correct fit all of the time.
They are becoming more common; my latest ikea thing came with some, but it's pretty visually obvious, is all I'm saying. Once you know what they are, you aren't gonna get it mixed up.
JIS vs Phillips, on the other hand, is usually way less clear cut. I mean, JIS is supposed to have the dimple, but it doesn't always, and figuring out which of your screwdrivers is the JIS is even harder. (I personally am having a hard time finding JIS screwdrivers that are... decent. most of the sets I see that are clearly marked are really low end sets from Hozan (which is a fine tool company, it's just that the JIS screwdriver sets I see that are clearly marked as such are... pretty low end compared to my wera/whia/xcelite drivers.
Ah, I must be using the wrong driver then. Oh wait, nope, it's stripping because it's just inherently inferior. Sorry, you always see people pointing out the existence of Pozidriv, but it really makes little difference. They both strip like you've tucked a hundred in their thong.
And then we get into the joy of JIS screwdrivers. Good god, the amount of stripped fasteners on japanese motorcycles caused by that slight angle change is ludicrous, and they're nearly impossible to tell apart by looking at them. The only reliable way to know is prior experience/national origin.
Another common failure mode is to use a driver that is too small. For a lot of people you need to look at the head, then pick the driver 1 size larger than you think you need for the screw. It's deceptive.
You will be surprised how much less prone to stripping it is once you have the correct size driver.
When my wife and I bought our house, I thought the previous owner had stripped the hell out of some Phillips screws... then I learned what Robertson (square) screws were.
After getting the proper bit though, I’ve started to really appreciate them. I don’t think I’ve ever stripped a single one.
Robertson is excellent but they seem to be a uniquely Canadian phenomenon. My company ships robots to the US in big crates, and we've had to switch to building them with Philips screws instead because of issues with local availability.
Robertson (Square) drive are also gaining popularity in building decking applications in the U.S. I've seen quite a few options in Home Depot / Lowes stores in the Northeast. One of reasons they are less popular than Philips is the price as square drives are a little bit more expensive and tend to be offered at premium brand screws.
Maybe it's a regional thing? Here in the midwest US the hardware stores carry them and Phillips, in about 50:50 proportion -- At least for construction screws (decking screws for example) this is true. Most of the contractors I know locally prefer them as well.
They are around here, but I'd say star point (not sure if they are double square or Torx), seem to be as prevalent at Home Depot as Robertson. I'm in Colorado, so on the cusp of the West.
> Here in the midwest US the hardware stores carry them and Phillips, in about 50:50 proportion -- At least for construction screws (decking screws for example) this is true.
I've seen them too, but only as construction screws. I've never seen a square drive sheet metal or machine screw in the US, for instance.
My dad used to work at an aluminium joinery company in New Zealand. They only used Robertson screws. I used to work there during shoot holidays. Only screws that never fell off the drill bit and never ended up a mess. Super easy to find st hardware stories too. Dad only used those at home.
It should be noted that Robertson screwdriver holds a screw in without the use of magnets. It makes things so much easier and is by far my favorite type.
Ha I just finished banging out an impassioned comment about how much I appreciate Robertsons compared to terrible, stripped-out Phillips. And don't tell me they were Pozidriv. I've known about that difference for a long time. They're still trash.
I have half a mind that they invented Pozidriv just to have a defense for how terrible the Phillips fastener is.
As a teenager I stripped nearly all the screws holding the crankcase of my motorcycle together before realizing that JIS was different from Phillips. Didn't help that most of the old steel screws had seized against the aluminium crankcase. After a few unsuccessful attempts with an impact driver, I ended up just welding nuts to the heads, waiting for the heat to soak, then then wrenching them off. Then threw the lot out and replaced them with something sensible - stainless internal hex head screws.
I guess the original theory for JIS was that its easier to replace a screw you've mangled then it is to replace the internal thread you stripped by over torquing it.
Stainless will sieze in aluminium much easier than plain steel due to https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_corrosion . Anti-sieze copper paste recommended if stainless is used, and it's often not a bad idea in any case.
I had similar experiences. Buying a set of JIS screwdrivers was one of the best decisions I ever made. They even work on screws that have been mangled by improper tools. I haven't stripped a screw head since, though I've had to use an impact driver on a few really stubborn ones.
I'm astonished to learn that Robertson are a Canadian thing! My grandfather was a cabinet-maker and god save you if you used something else in front of him.
Stupid question but I've been doing alot of construction lately and using Torx (25 I think?) for everything. What's the advantage of Robertson screws? (in particular for woodworking)
Robertson has a really nice taper that makes one handed operation really easy even when the screw metal isn't magnetic. The large size of the recess also means you can work Robertson screws even after they have been painted or varnished over. Robertson sizing is also incredibly simple so you grab the right tool every time. Each size has a colour name so you can easily call out each size to a tool fetching assistant (always my role as a kid) and there is no ambiguity if the screwdriver is the right size or not.
Not a ton of advantages over Torx for initial assembly, but if you ever need to repair, especially someone else's work, Robertson is second to none.
Robertson in Canada is just appeal to tradition at this point. They have no technical merit over Torx except maybe ease of ad-hoc construction of a driver.
Unfortunately Robertson bits are rare south of the Canadian border. I have lots of "universal" bit sets, and only one came with a set of Robertsons. (Most did come with square bits, but these are apparently not the same as Robertson, either in dimension or shape.)
Interesting historical point: Apple started using the pentalobe fasteners in their iPhones in order to make it more difficult for end users to service their phones.
Is this the reason they have switched to Pentalobe screw. I have googled for material but couldn't find anything. Pentalobe screws are not that hard to find and considering the popularity of Apple devices, they will get easier to find.
When I compare them to Torx screws I suppose the points rounder shape makes the screwdriver more resistant, which may be an advantage when assembly millions.
I am no expert, and I would appreciate if someone has an informed opinion.
Not sure how common in the rest of the world it is, but in New Zealand it's quite common to have screws that are a combo-bit, and accept Phillips/pozi drive and also Robertson drive. The construction industry is a bit split between Pozi and Robertson, or at least it was a few years ago.
Robertson drive is an amazing drive for construction work. The screws stick nicely onto magnetised drivers, so that you can screw them into awkward locations, and they're really resistant to stripping the head. In this day and age, you can set the maximum torque on most electric screwdrivers/drills, so there's no need for a drive that intrinsically limits the torque like Phillips drives.
I first noticed this on electrical components like switches, receptacles, and breakers here in the US, a few months ago. All the screws on the devices themselves are flat, Phillips (maybe Pozi, didn't check) and square. I was remodeling my kitchen and adding some circuits, replacing all the devices, and pigtailing all the old Aluminum.
I'd like to see the development of these on a timeline, including the rise of power tools. I suspect that hex, torx, and similar are only feasible due to torque-control being available on modern driving tools; prior to that the screw had to be able to disengage (cam out) to prevent it breaking.
This touches on what you're talking about. If you have the time the entire video's a gem of history screw history touching on Nails going into screw coatings, drives, etc.
You might enjoy this article from about 6 months ago (as I did). It doesn't get into torx or hex drives, but covers quite a bit of history of Phillips-like drives.
In the UK construction industry the pozidrive has long been the most used, followed by some special purpose designs using torx. Sometimes kitchens would come with the same crappy phillips screws as flatpack furniture.
However belt feed drywall screws were always phillips. In fact most drywall screws were. It always infuriated me if you wanted to put some extras in with a drill (or take some out) that you had to go searching for a PH2. I wondered if there was some special reason for it persisting with drywall screws, especially when screwing drywall is relative new to the UK, with most being nailed up until maybe 15 years ago? Auto feed drywall guns cam out like crazy...
Now I also wonder why we would always call the drywall "plasterboard" yet call the screws for it "drywall screws"!
drywall is the only place where phillips still makes sense: you will never remove them anyway and the cam out feature cams out at the right place.
Note that drywall screws are brittle and worthless for anything other tan drywall even though people use them for almost anything. On the rare case you need to remove drywall you break it out, and then break the screws off.
I had to buy a set of tripoint drivers to open up and work on Gameboys. That was annoying (I've never seen them anywhere else).
For some reason my RV (an old 1984 Avion) uses Robertson screws nearly everywhere, which is actually nice. The big chunky square holds up to rust and corrosion better than Phillips. Kinda wish more things used Robertson.
I work for a company that makes scientific equipment. We apply a few basic criteria, which narrow things down a lot.
First, a lot of those fasteners are either really specialized or just rare or obsolete. So they can be ruled out.
We look for something that will be easy for our assemblers, and for our field service technicians. They have given us feedback on what they like and dislike, including what kinds of tools are common in different parts of the world. They hate flat head screws. Hex socket screws are really easy, and it's also easy to make them look nice on an assembly.
To an increasing extent, we want tools that can be used with a torque handle. For instance hex drive is better than Philips in that regard.
I hate to say that it's still a work in progress, but we are heroically trying to get away from fractional drivers, especially for our field technicians who presently have to carry full sets of US and metric tools. We even have mixtures of US and metric in some products!
If something is meant to be serviced by a customer (e.g., a lamp or filter that gets replaced), then we stick with Philips, which we are told is common worldwide. Or we use a captive knurled fastener if it's in a place where there's finger access.
So these are just a few thoughts. Other considerations are whether you're in an industry that has already standardized on a particular tool set, such as metric allen wrenches for bikes.
My experience with flat head screws in a production environment was the driver slipping out of the screw and scratching the paint on the part being assembled. Boo!
My experience with Philips is, works great as long as people use the exact correct driver, which they won't. Which results in a striped screw and a striped driver. The latter like a bad penny will go on to strip more screws till someone holy and wise (me) tosses it in the dumpster.
So Flat, just don't. Philips is okay for light duty. Anything else use a Torx or Hex.
> We even have mixtures of US and metric in some products!
In North America, tire sizes are given in millimeter width, but imperial mounting diameter. E.g. 175-65R14: 175mm width, 65% aspect ratio (sidewall height to width or something like that), for a 14" wheel.
I just learned about Nominal Pipe Size, in which the number that precedes the word "inches" does not refer to any actual measurement on the pipe. The specific characteristic of the gas grill pipe hookup on the back of my house that makes it a "half inch pipe" is that it has a .84 inch outer diameter; there is literally nothing about it, including the inner diameter, that could be described by the words "half inch".
Then of course there's North American dimensional lumber, where the actual dimensions are either 1/4, 1/2, or 3/4 inches less than the nominal dimensions. A 2x4 is 1.5 x 3.5 inches.
The history is a little more interesting than that:
> Lumber's nominal dimensions are larger than the actual standard dimensions of finished lumber. Historically, the nominal dimensions were the size of the green (not dried), rough (unfinished) boards that eventually became smaller finished lumber through drying and planing (to smooth the wood). Today, the standards specify the final finished dimensions and the mill cuts the logs to whatever size it needs to achieve those final dimensions. Typically, that rough cut is smaller than the nominal dimensions because modern technology makes it possible and it uses the logs more efficiently. For example, a "2×4" board historically started out as a green, rough board actually 2 by 4 inches (51 mm × 102 mm). After drying and planing, it would be smaller, by a nonstandard amount. Today, a "2×4" board starts out as something smaller than 2 inches by 4 inches and not specified by standards, and after drying and planing is reliably 1½ by 3½ inches (38 mm × 89 mm).
It seems bizarre to me to define the standard 'size' of an item based on some aspect of the manufacturing process that is not part of the final product the user will ever see, or could measure.
Shoe sizes often measure the size of the last, not the foot. One shoe company I've bought from in the past had a warning on their webpage that they use different manufacturing processes for different models, so the same numbered size of two similar-looking shoes actually differ by quite a bit.
I also find shoe numbering bizarre. How could such a numbering system survive to this day? Why not use goddamn centimeters?
(Fortunately, e-stores selling shoes were bitten enough by the ridiculousness of that problem that they ended up providing scales translating shoe numbers to centimeters.)
Ultimately, the best workaround I've seen was the one the father of my SO used - he would measure the foot of his child, then cut a wooden stick to appropriate length, and go with that stick to the shoes store.
There is a bit of insanity in that women's and children's sizes are derived from that in more than one way.
There are two ways of determining size, but they are supposed to coincide, theoretically.
Manufacturers use the "last length" as the basis for shoe size. However, that is not the foot length, and how a shoe with a given "last length" fits a given foot is a variable and so the fit ultimately requires testing. The last length is supposed to be about two shoe sizes larger than the foot length.
The last length formula is L3 - 24. So a last length of 12 inches (one foot) corresponds to size 12. From there, surrounding sizes are 1/3 of an inch increments. Which is the odd thing: where else you do you see increments of 1/3 inch?
Thus, in any case, if you have a 12" foot, that's a US men's size 14.
The foot measuring instrument you see in stores, Brannock's Device, accounts for this and so its formula is L3 - 22.
So these sizing systems are intended to coincide, but are different estimators.
You can see that using centimeters doesn't solve all the problems. Suppose centimeters were used, but the manufacturers used last-length centimeters rather than foot centimeters. You'd have to convert your foot length to last length according to some rule of thumb, and then ultimately resolve things by trying the shoe. If manufacturers had to use foot centimeters, they wouldn't be able to measure some trivial property of the shoe like last size to determine size. Foot centimeters aren't absolute; they would have to use some representative model of a foot and base it off that: still no guarantee that a 27cm size based on a representative model foot fits your 27cm foot.
I own two pairs of men's boots, from different companies, with US sizes on the label 2.5 apart from each other. They're the same physical size, and both fit me perfectly. That's pretty typical. I generally have to try new shoes in about a 3-size range.
According to the L x 3 - 24 rule, these boot should be nearly an inch different (or at least, their lasts). Maybe the US system is theoretically simple, but in practice it seems to be just an arbitrary number that can't be meaningfully compared to anything except the same model of shoe from the same company.
In contrast, I've ordered shoes from Japan 3 times, from 3 different companies, and I did it by putting a ruler next to my foot, and then choosing that number of centimeters in the online form. Every time, I got a shoe that fits great.
Maybe using an absolute length doesn't solve all problems, but my experience (with sample size of probably N<20) is that it works far better in practice. An arbitrary unit of measurement removes accountability, by way of obfuscation, and gains us nothing.
Yeah, I meant "foot centimeters" - the issue isn't about metric vs. imperial, I'm just writing from European experience. The issue is about "foot" vs "last" vs "shoe numbers".
I'm not fully convinced by the argument that manufacturers (or at least distributors) can't use foot centimeters - after all, somehow I can successfully buy shoes on-line by measuring my foot and then using vendor-provided foot-length-to-shoe-size conversion scale to pick appropriate size. From the experience of myself and everyone else I asked around, this works reliably.
But it's equivalent (in terms of capacity and robustness) to all other half inch pipes, the first of which had a half inch diameter. Or something like that - the Wikipedia page is complicated.
In some ways that's more useful. If you're designing a gas pipe for a house you probably care more about "how much gas can I get through this pipe" and "what is the failure rate" than "will I be able to fit it through a 0.83 inch hole".
It's annoying that "half inch" etc were the terms co-opted here instead of, say, "a level 4 pipe". But there is some reason for it.
No it isn't equivalent to all other pipes in terms of capacity and robustness. It is equivalent to the COMMON pipe today, but you still have to watch because some applications use the same thread/outside diameter but the walls are thicker. Also there are still some old pipes out there that really do have the 1/2 inch inside diameter, they are equivalent in terms of robustness, but obviously not capacity.
Of course I'm being pedantic - in reality you will probably never encounter the exceptions.
Is it correct to say it's equivalent or better than the "standard" half inch pipe in all three of: inside diameter (larger is better), outside diameter (smaller is better) and robustness? With the "standard" half inch pipe actually being an old type that is now obsolete?
Being pedantic again, there are cases where more inside diameter is not better. Some chemicals are unstable and dangerous when concentrated into too much volume: by increasing the inside diameter you make them more likely to explode. (acetylene - C2H2 - is the only one I can think of where this could matter). On the same lines, if the pipe is subject to heat/flame there is another case where modern metals might be worse by allowing thinner walls.
Again, this is only pedantic. In the unlikely event that the above matters you need a professional engineer (a legal term) to specify the exact properties of the pipe.
That's not even a North America only thing, as far as I know the format mm-%R/D" (175-65R14) is used universal. Of course only vintage cars have diagonal tires now so you will probably not see a tire with D
I noticed that the other day too! Dumb question but what does the rest of the world do? Do they convert inches to mm or is the inches diameter just an approximation of the more exact metric diameters?
I can't speak for cars, but there's a similar situation with bicycle wheels and tires. There are all sorts of historical measures, such as "26 inch" and "700c," but at the same time most rims and tires are marked with ISO dimensions that are in mm and quite well defined.
So for instance my "27 x 1-1/8" tires are also ISO 28-630, where 28 is the approximate inflated width, and 630 is a particular dimension of the rim. When I buy a new tire, I look at the ISO number to make sure I got the right size.
I recently restored an old Schwinn with its own oddball tire diameter, but ISO numbers published by modern tire makers got me up and running with new tires.
I think that in a lot of cases, English vs metric is a moot point because a tool is so specialized (spark plug wrench) or because production tools are computerized and switch unit systems as needed. On a milling machine, all dimensions boil down to the number of stripes on a precision glass scale, regardless of what units you choose to specify.
Historically, there are bike parts with mm diameter and English thread pitch, such as some old French pedals.
There's a lovely little book called "One Good Turn" by Witold Rybczynski subtitled 'A Natural History of the Screwdriver and the Screw' A pure delight for those interested in such things like me.
I suspect the tool industry has a strong incentive to keep as many of them as possible in use.
I have a feeling that they push new designs to manufacturers as being 'tamper-proof', then once sufficiently adopted, push them to the sales channel to be open to open these tamper-proof screws. Repeat as needed to keep revenue up.
It might be in the long run. Torx is the clear common-place winner, but it was patent-encumbered for a long time. I bet even Ikea will switch to them eventually.
That largely depends on which country you're looking at, which industry you're looking at, and whether or not you recognise the difference between Phillips and pozidriv.
Rest assured, I was hoping for a detailed comparison and explanation of the differences between them and e.g. Roller Screws.
Advocating for Torx seems to be nice though.
I suspect that aside from tamper proof designs, most screw head development is driven from the manufacturing or assembly side. After all, most screws will never be unscrewed.
That's because they don't want you to unscrew them. There's a bit of a feedback loop here - the less user-serviceable stuff you make, the less users expect to be able to fix things themselves, so there's less need to make next things user-serviceable.
Totally. I'm a bit shocked how effective this is. For years the sight of a torx or rarer socket would stop me from even thinking about opening a device. I don't know if it was impossible to find before but today you can buy most heads easily. And when you think about it, it's just a damn contact surface for a lever.. don't stop (unless there's a real safety hazard)
I find this to be really weird... Anyone who has worked on vehicles knows the importance of getting the exact right tool to unfasten a fastener (and the... consequences of using something that "almost works" - usually meaning you have to spend hours trying to get the fastener out)
I mean, sure, you need tools to open things up... but the right bit is about a thousand times more important than an expensive bit, and for $10, you can get a huge assortment of cheap bits that are good enough for the home gamer.
This always baffled me about the apple pentalobe haters... I mean, using a different screwdriver head is not the unfriendly part of taking an apple apart. The glued-in bits are the unfriendly part.
> Anyone who has worked on vehicles knows the importance of getting the exact right tool to unfasten a fastener
If you're a pro auto shop, you can probably get your hands on all of the exactly right tools. If you're an individual, it's another story...
It's a matter of lag in the supply/demand loop. The moment Apple introduced pentalobe screws, or in general, the moment a different company introduces an unusual screw head, is the moment when you're very unlikely to be able to get your hands on appropriate drivers. As more and more products use the new head, the demand becomes big enough that eventually, appropriate drivers get available and cheap. From what I've seen, this can take years - longer than the lifetime of the first iteration of a product using the new screws. Enough to destroy end-user repairability for a whole category of products. After a while, the company will change screw heads again, rinse and repeat.
And the glue. That's just companies being assholes.
(Yes, I know there are technical benefits of using glue. They're especially pronounced if you don't consider end-user or third-party serviceability in your design process, and even more so if you explicitly try to eliminate it in your business strategy.)
>If you're a pro auto shop, you can probably get your hands on all of the exactly right tools. If you're an individual, it's another story...
Meh, I'm mostly talking about getting the right socket for the job... I mean, don't use the ASE socket that is almost the same as the metric bolt you are working on, go down to the hardware store and get the right tool.
That's the thing about automotive work; as far as I can tell, automotive tools are very widely available and cheap, compared to other tools I've worked with, and not only that, but you go to the auto parts store, and the people are helpful and knowledgeable. I mean, if I need some SAC305 on the weekend, well, fry's might have that, maybe, but nobody there will know the difference between SAC305 and sn99. If I need any sort of server-grade parts, I'm almost certainly stuck waiting for monday. Fry's has a very small selection of ECC memory or enterprise-grade disks, for example. And you aren't going to have a Fry's in a small town, but you will have a Napa auto or similar.
I mean, part of it is that I know a fair bit about computers and really not all that much about cars, but when I show up even at the chain auto parts stores, they can answer even relatively difficult questions. This is not, in my experience, true of Frys.
When it comes to tech support, be it a computer or a car that needs fixing, the difficulty of a question is directly proportional to it's vagueness. Newbies are more likely to ask difficult questions than more experienced and knowledgeable people who actually know enough to tell you what the actual problem is.
>I mean, don't use the ASE socket that is almost the same as the metric bolt you are working on
Just use whatever fits tightest. Fasteners get smaller from rust.
Some people organize their sockets by size and ignore which unit they're sized in.
> they can answer even relatively difficult questions. This is not, in my experience, true of Frys.
This is only because you don't know what you don't know and don't have reason to ask complicated or very specific questions at the auto parts store whereas you do at the computer store. The median parts counter person has the same depth of knowledge across basically all industries.
>If you're a pro auto shop, you can probably get your hands on all of the exactly right tools. If you're an individual, it's another story...
If you're an individual, you go to Harbor Freight and get yourself a tool set for $10 or $20. Tools are dirt cheap these days, and there's no excuse to not have the right one if you want to work on something.
Glue also fall in that case. It feels like a problem but more often than you know it's possible to unglue something. It just require different tools and knowledge.
Some phone makers are even kind enough to put removal tabs on the adhesive holding the battery in, so you can just heat it a tiny bit and pull on the tab to put a new battery in (still voids your warranty though).
Glue is often an afterthought, when they discover that the meager number of screws doesn't hold the product together and they're a month from shipping.
sure, for heavy machines you'll know because you can't get away with random tools. For electronics, you can force some screws out even with plyers if need be
Same here. The first couple of years I encountered torx sockets, I called them "those ones they put to prevent you from repairing things". The drivers weren't impossible to find, but they also weren't commonplace.
It was doubly annoying when I had devices that had regular cruciform sockets (that I could even handle with a knife if in a hurry) on the outside, but then suddenly torx sockets inside.
after a year of toying with devices and watching people on youtube I'm a lot more unorthodox.. anything goes as long as it's not too stupid. Yesterday I used a knife and a wrench to open a braun toothbrush.
I never held back much when fixing my own stuff either. But it's a different game when I'm fixing things for someone else (e.g. a friend or family member) - then I really don't want to break or even scratch anything.
Recently I found a lcd tv outside, turns out one chip was partially failing, now it seems stable. Then my neighbor told me it was hers, which was a bit fun and awkward; but to be honest, had they ask me to fix it I would never have touched it. It's easier when it's considered trash and nothing to lose.
That is when you thank her for putting it out nicely instead of banging it up some more, implying that she did mean for someone else to come along and adopt it.
I find it interesting that so many people here see the choice as being between Phillips and Torx -- all the time I was growing up (in the UK), Torx bits were incredibly difficult to get hold of while Pozidriv became more and more common, to the point where I don't think I've any loose non-Pozidriv screws in the house, and I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone selling Torx screws.
I like the connectors that were used on the Capsela toys. The two mating parts were identical, each with three prongs. It looks like a radiation symbol that is missing the center dot.
An interesting property is that there would be no need to carefully match the diameter.
If you work with wood/carpentry construction in Canada, a higher percentage of things are square drive (Robertson). They were less common until recently in the USA due to patent licensing issues.
The only real reason for Phillips screw heads were the old electromechanical industry robots that would rely on auto-centering and spring tension to pop the driver out of the screw against a switch at the set torque. Modern (since 1980s or so) industry robots are computer-driven and torque-sensing. Phillips (and Pozidriv) needs to die in favor of modern superior screw drive designs like Torx.
They don't strip, or at least it would take a tremendous amount of torque to strip them. My experience has been that the driver strips before the head does.
That stripping the driver before the screw is a feature. Heads come with every box of screws I buy, and getting out ruined screws is far harder than replacing the driver.
Happens with the better ones as well, it's just a matter of setting the torque limiter of your screwdriver/coordless drill to match the job. Sometimes takes a few mistakes, but it's safer to start with a low setting and adjust up until you have the right torque for the screw.
It's interesting that a lot of these variants were/are being created as security or tamper-proof mechanisms, a real world type of "security through obscurity" (although a different type of obscurity than is usually meant by that phrase). Then it becomes not obscure enough and they make a new type of screw.
It's all about force and material properties. The drive type doesn't matter as long as it can handle the force it will see. If the tool and the fastener fit well the limitation is usually whatever has the smallest minor diameter.
If you keep stripping Phillips head screws, and they aren't Pozidriv (or JIS)[0], it could be that you should buy better screwdrivers. Well made screw drivers engage the head much more postively than poorly made ones. Unfortunately, virtually everything available in the muggle tool aisle is poorly made. This includes Kobalt, Husky, and Craftsman. I've owned screwdrivers made by all 3, and none of them can hold a candle to a truly good screwdriver.
If you want good screw drivers, Klein makes excellent ones. Klein's target market is electricians, and you can sometimes find them in the electrical aisle in muggle stores. Alternately, an electrical supply house (i.e. a wizard store) will probably stock them (or something equally good). Expect to pay $10 USD per screwdriver. It's worth it.
The other option I can personally vouch for is the Snap-On. Their market is principally mechanics. I haven't bought any, only used a friends, so I can't comment on how to buy them (online or find a truck, I'd imagine), or what to expect to pay.
TL;DR: Shop where the pros shop if you want good tools. For most pros, the most expensive part of a job is their time, so it's worth not having tools that take up a lot of it because they aren't good.
Quick and mostly accurate test for is a store a wizard store or a muggle store: Are they open on weekends? If so, odds are it's a muggle store.
[0] JIS is also superficially similar to Pozidriv and Phillips, and also mutually incompatible. Honda apparently uses them. I found out when I mentioned I destroyed a P2 impact bit on a stuck screw (from America's leading purveyor of single-use tools, admittedly) on a Honda form. I was educated.
ETA: Not a pro in the domain of electricity or mechanics, but as a woodworker, it's important to have good screwdrivers to avoid stripping brass screws, which are much softer than steel.
Ikea screws are not Phillips, they're actually Pozidriv, which is different enough to matter. Do not use a Phillips screwdriver to assemble Ikea furnature, as that combination will easily cam out and ruin the (typically soft metal) screw. It's easiest to buy the correct Pozidriv screwdriver bits from Ikea, but they're also available online.
My understanding is that Pozidriv is as popular in Europe as Phillips is in America. They look so similar that you probably won't know the difference unless you're told about it.
> Pozidriv and Phillips are not interchangeable. While Pozidriv screwdrivers fit Phillips screws, they may slip or tear out the Phillips screw head. Conversely, while Phillips screwdrivers will loosely fit and turn Pozidriv screws, they will cam out if enough torque is applied, potentially damaging the screw head or screwdriver.
Ugh, except Pozidriv will still cam and tear up their own screws, and same with Phillips. That's the secret to this tidbit of information that is never included. They're both trash fasteners when used with a slightly different driver, but they're also trash even when used correctly.
Robertson for life. When I was young I had a job assembling furniture and that, along with a couple Allen socket fasteners, was the only thing we used. Phillips fasteners that came with assemblies went straight into metal recycling to hopefully get born again as something worthwhile. You can practically drive a Robertson head straight through the center of the Earth with the amount of torque it handles. Never have to waste time drilling pilot holes.
If I was made dictator for a day, I'd immediately outlaw Phillips and Pozidriv. Even flat head is better than those pieces of junk.
There are a lot of Phillips fasteners that will also fit a Robertson bit. Just try both with the same screw. It's ludicrous how instantly you'll realize the Robertson is better.
Last time I tried to use a Robertson screw from Home Depot in a heavy duty application (building an AC frame and decking), it cammed out and the square opening in the screw literally became round. I tried compensating by applying more downward force, but eventually it was still camming out and the bit itself became a cylinder.
It maybe better, but if the manufacturing quality is garbage, it's just as useless as the other ones.
I've only been using torx screws from 2012 onward. Never cammed out once and I'm still using 5 year old bits (they work like new)
Huh. I've never had that happen once out of literally thousands of screws from all kinds of different sources, including HD. Should be impossible for it to cam because the walls of the cavity are perpendicular. There's no thrust force being generated.
I have some R2 stainless "decking" (read: general construction) screws, and a standard consumer cordless impact driver generates enough transient torque to actually deform the cavity. Which even then results in the bit being "sticky" to pull out. I would imagine after several use cycles, the drive would be completely stripped.
While I generally agree that neither are great (I prefer Torx), are they not designed to protect whatever it is you are fastening from over-tightening bolts?
Phillips isn't properly designed for power or hand tools. If it strips with a screwdriver, it's definitely going to strip with a drill. I've rarely seen power-driven Phillips screws that didn't have some sign of stripping, even using torque limiters and even on things fresh from the factory.
At least flat head takes uneven torque from hand tools well. It also allows improvised tools to be used in the field. If I'm working on say an off-road vehicle like a dirt bike, I'm going to tend to use just one size of hex bolt (usually 10mm) and flat heads for the screws.
Nope, you are confused about the meaning of cam-out. Flat head is actually significantly less likely to cam out than pretty much any screw fastener type besides inverted hex (allen). Cam out is when the torque applied acts to ramp the driver out of the fastener. The problem with flat head is that drivers do not self center, making them poor choices for power tools.
There's a reason flat head screws are still used extensively in firearms manufacture, and it definitely isn't a manufacturing convenience. Carefully driving a flathead screw is much less likely to damage the finish of the fastener, provided the correct driver is used.
Ah-ha, I might have mixed up with the screw "stripping" with cam-out but repeatedly cam-out is definitely the main reason to create a stripped screw. Evidently, the cam-out nature of the Philips screw is by design[1] to enable torque-limited application to prevent over-tightening, so it's a feature not a defect!
IMMO, IKEA should switch to use square drive or torx drive to better eliminate the risk of cam-out. Pozidriv is more complex to manufacture (than Philips drive) but arguably less resistant to cam-out than sqaure drive (easier to manufacture too) or torx drive.
Ikea sells a $8 tool set that includes three sizes of Pozidriv bits - and other bits that perfectly fit their various connectors. It's well worth the cost if you're planning to assemble anything you got from IKEA and not lose your mind.
They also have, or had, a circa $25 corded drill kit for sale (going by memory of briefly seeing, a year or two ago).
If someone doesn't have a drill and is contemplating purchasing and constructing a substantial piece of IKEA furniture, such as my parent's TV stand -- lots of bits to screw together. Under those circumstances, I suggest maybe they want to buy one of the drill kits.
I expect you can get a better corded drill elsewhere, and buy the relevant bits, for not much more. But, KISS, with regard to the amount of shopping to be done.
P.S. Well, what do you know. US $20, now, and cordless.
In this case, I think there may be a few additional factors.
In the U.S., at least, many may view $20 as a "throwaway" level purchase to improve the assembly effort of the furniture they're purchasing/assembling.
Assembly is frustrating. A power tool and appropriate bits help, but then negotiating a cord takes it back somewhat in a negative direction. Plus, it's probably difficult and expensive to made and sell such a drill with a usefully long power cord. So, the purchaser then also need to negotiate acquiring and using an extension cord. And, you don't want them using the cord they use for that lamp in the corner; the drill's potential draw likely exceeds the rating of the extension cord most users will end up plugging it into.
IKEA has some language on the cordless drill's page specifically describing it being engineered to avoid idle battery drain.
People love cordless. Cordless sells. Many of them have no clue about what you describe, and meanwhile, cordless sells. :-/
Probably because there are little marks on the top of each pozidrive screws that indicate it is different. The don’t explain it in Europe either, it’s just a thing you should notice and account for when building stuff. I would put identifying pozidrive vs Phillips in the same camp as just knowing how to use a screw driver but perhaps I’m being harsh
I think from your comment you may be from Europe, so in that case for added context, you may be underestimating how uncommon Pozidriv screws and screwdrivers are in the United States. I have never seen a Pozidriv screw on any manufactured product other than Ikea furniture in the US. You cannot buy Pozidriv screws or drivers at major hardware stores (try searching "Pozidriv" on Lowes, Home Depot, or Ace Hardware), with the exception of one or two drivers that are in stock online only.
So consider that this is an extremely rare fastener format in the US market, and which looks almost identical to Phillips (the most common US screwdriver). I think many people like myself who are interested in tools and hardware are aware of Pozidriv and can identify it easily, but I can completely see why the average US consumer mistakes it for Phillips.
Interesting, I did not realize square drive was uncommon in the UK. It's a really nice screw head to work with, and as someone mentioned elsewhere in the thread, becoming more common in certain woodworking applications in the US.
It's a Canadian invention, and to this day quite localized to Canada, where it's nearly the standard for carpentry (at least, every deck screw I've ever seen here is Robertson drive). It's good that it's catching on, it has a few distinct advantages over Phillips, my favourite being that you can mount a screw on the driver and it will stay on the driver due to an interference fit, freeing your other hand to secure, support, or stabilize.
Parochialism-induced harshness — what could go wrong? POZIDRIV® bits are practically unheard of here (Canada); you have to go out of your way to find them, on the level of triwing or pentalobe, or JIS.
I found this out a few years ago after stripping several IKEA screws and getting incredibly frustrated. Bought a couple Pozidriv screwdrivers on Amazon, and they worked like a charm.
Just to make the point: I've stripped out more torx drivers than I have torx heads.
I can say I truly don't understand how phillips ever even took hold over flatheads. Cheap phillips head screws seem designed to strip out.
Somebody elsewhere in this thread made the point that they are self-centering, and make industrial manufacturing easier. I guess that makes sense.