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Yes, but still. The essence of a tax is its involuntary nature. The mafia's numbers racket was a tax, or would be but for the mafia's lack of legitimacy (if you consider being a legitimate government a precondition for levying a tax). You played or someone broke your legs or burned down your house. Last time I checked, no state is doing anything like that. There are many things wrong with state-run lotteries, but they're not a tax. If you don't like the way the lottery is priced, don't play. Your kneecaps won't know the difference.


If tomorrow the government decides only it can sell gasoline, and it does so with a 35% margin, that's strictly more restrictive than an excise tax.


I'm not saying that state monopolies are good. I'm saying that people need to get over the idea that everything they dislike or disagree with is "a tax". It isn't. A state monopoly on fuel would be almost impossible to avoid, and you could reasonably assert that it's a tax (there would be debate, but your position would be reasonable). After all, even if you don't yourself consume fuel, almost every product you could possibly buy has to be transported from somewhere, and most transportation services available today use fuel. A lottery is nothing like that. The product, such as it is, does not form a component of the cost of any other product. All you have to do to avoid giving the state money is not play the lottery, which should be very easy since they are very up front about the fact that a ticket is not only -ev but much more -ev than any casino or cardroom game you could possibly play. If people stopped playing, the state would either give up its monopoly or (in a classic monopoly-monopsony dynamic) cut its prices. And in the meantime, ex-players would be better off as well.


Sounds like we are just talking semantics.

When you buy liquor, you pay the market price (call it $10) plus an excise tax that the government adds on (let's say $2).

Imagine the government nationalizes the liquor business. The buy up every liquor company, and continue operating them the same way as before ($10 price + $2 tax). I think anyone would agree that this $2 would still be considered a tax.

Now let's say the government gets rid of the $2 tax, but bumps the price of liquor up to $12. The tax is still there, it's just implicit now.


> Imagine the government nationalizes the liquor business.

I live in Toronto, no need to imagine :(


If only it was simply 2$ and not what is closer to 10$.


Are liquor taxes not taxes?

You can absolutely avoid paying them by not drinking, and millions of people indeed do just that, but the fact that a tax is easily avoidable does not make it any less of a tax.


There are huge negative externalities to liquor which muddles the issue. If not forcing people to pay a carbon tax is a subsidy then the 'liquor' tax may not be an economic tax.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality

Gas taxes are perhaps the clearest example of this where you can directly compare revenue with costs.


The "tax" part of the lottery is a component of the gambling part. The gambling part is the product people pay for. Just like a tax on cigarettes, or in some countries a tax on every consumer product (VAT). You can always avoid the tax by not buying the product or reduce it by buying cheaper products, but we still call it a tax.


Here in Pennsylvania, only the state can sell liquor (with a few exceptions - e.g. bars can sell drinks and producers can sell their wares which are generally wine here).


> You played or someone broke your legs or burned down your house

The Mafia didn't force people to play their numbers games. They didn't need to. There were more than enough willing and voluntary participants.


You played or someone broke your legs or burned down your house. Last time I checked, no state is doing anything like that.

I think that the major difference comes from the magnitude of the power.

You are describing two possible measures: reducing somebodies mobility and destroying financial situation.

State can in both situations be a lot of more effective and therefore offer better competition against the mafia.

If a State wants to reduce somebodies mobility, it will arrest this person. In many cases this can be extended to eternity.

A state can be also more efficient in the second case - instead of burning down the house, state can just confiscate it.


Yes but can you provide a single instance in which the state did any of those things because someone chose not to play the lottery?

I'm usually the first guy ranting about excessive state power. I won't be hard to convince. Convince me.


Yeah. There's a big semantic difference between saying something is a tax and saying something is taxed.


What about sales tax? Is that not a tax? After all buying things is voluntary, you could (and some people do) live a self sufficient lifestyle and not have to pay any sales tax.




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