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Would you mind sharing a link / citation for this? Elm releases are intentionally long and the project appears to be ongoing [1].

[1]: https://iselmdead.info/

Edit: moved the position of the citation.


People are constantly asking for a pulse:

https://discourse.elm-lang.org/t/is-elm-browser-still-mainta...

https://discourse.elm-lang.org/t/request-elm-0-19-2-any-upda...

It's pretty sad. I personally believe the ecosystem would be in a much more vibrant state today, if the creator had formally abandoned the language at any point in the past, as there are many who would pick up the torch.

It is telling that several people who could once have been considered 'core team' are now building their own languages:

https://gren-lang.org/

https://www.roc-lang.org/

https://www.derw-lang.com/


I think A) Elm is done, not dead. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." (The JS folks should take a note.) and B) the natural next step is to make Elm-to-native compilers, which is now happening.

I think a lot of programmers get warped views of PL development from over-exposure to the badlands of Javascript. There are languages (like Prolog) that grow like trees, eh?


Mentioned elsewhere in this thread, but the lack of bug fixes imo makes it definitely seem dead. I'm all for stability and sticking to a core vision/set of principles, and agree with your point about the Javascript ecosystem. But not even having small updates to fix bugs here and there doesn't exactly scream "this project is alive but done".

Personally I do believe that the core team are working on things away from the public eye, and that's fair enough in order to keep focus without having to deal with everyone giving their own opinion or criticism. I just wish there was significantly more transparency in the process, and a few bones thrown to the community in the form of fixes.


I think everyone just means something different by dead.

I personally wouldn't use the word until Evan throws in the towel, but he's clearly still onboard. For example, https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend (yesterday).

I don't think we handle these kinds of oddball cases very gracefully which is evident in basically every HN discussion about Elm. If a language gains traction, then we demand a certain shape of expectations from it, and we're not very good at walking away with just "well, it ain't for me". It's not enough for us to just say that. It's like we have to linger around and ensure everybody else washes their hands of the tool, too.

I'm pretty sure Elm is past the point where anyone who doesn't like the glacial BDFL approach doesn't use it, and those who choose to use it don't care.


Well, I have no particular insight but I heard something about a compiler-to-native code project that might be taking up core team time, or maybe Evan is just burnt out from all the static. I just wish there were fewer people crapping on the kid and more recognition of what he accomplished, and will hopefully accomplish in the future.


They can proclaim Elm not dead all they want, but if you take a look at the main repo the last commit was over two years ago, and it was to set up an auto reply to PRs that they probably would not get a response.


He works on private branches to avoid speculation and pressure. Example, he gave this presentation yesterday: https://gotoaarhus.com/2023/sessions/2529/elm-on-the-backend


If people can credibly ask whether something is dead, then the project is dead.

Live projects appear to be alive. There is activity, developers to talk to, support to purchase, release notes to read, even if those release notes are just maintenance notes for mature software. If your evidence of life is pointing to a two year old forum comment, I hate to break it to you, it's dead.


Honestly, even just a tweet from the BDFL twice a year saying 'I still care about this' would be something.

It's impossible to evangelise something when the creator has seemingly taken his ball and gone home.

The idea that enterprise should use Elm is laughable.


Is iselmdead dead


The core team refuses to fix straightforward bugs: https://github.com/elm/compiler/issues/1773


Quintessential experience of talking to Elm core team: https://github.com/elm/compiler/issues/1773#issuecomment-418...

What's funny, rtfeldman uses case expression with numbers in his (in OP's blogpost) praised library elm-hex, so it's not the problem of numbers vs variants. Only negative numbers are the problem.


> Elm releases are intentionally long and the project appears to be ongoing [1].

Sounds like a case of the halting problem.


The go to is still Emacs with CIDER however, there are many who are using Visual Studio or Cursive [1]

[1]: https://cursive-ide.com/


OP here. Thanks for reading the post! I agree with you. It seems that the HN crowd is very much interested in tools while I explicitly mention that the tool question is the least important one. I'm curious to know why folks are more interested in tools than principles or why there is little discussion about the principles.


Re-reading your post, I would say it comes from implied disagreement with your deprioritization of the right tools. You also use the word system a lot in the essay, which mentally translates to tool for a lot of people (myself included, if I’m not careful.) It’s also hard to do more than mildly agree or disagree with GTD and energy management principles. I also suspect anyone disagreeing with your main point, coming into this thread to insist they can remember everything to do, would be attacked. I agree more variety in the discussion would be nice.


OP here. I enjoy using Mathematica and that was the simple reason for it. Thanks for reading!


Great questions!

1. How would you keep it discussion-centric (not GoodReads) ...?

2. How will this be any different than a simple online forum about literature?

To answer your first question -- the idea is to use the guided questions as a basis for your discussion. So, you already start on firm ground followed by questions/prompts for the group you're in. A lot of this is dependent on the UI/UX however, I am considering having structured responses which aren't entirely free form or even, a series of responses with a mix of both.

Why is this not just a forum about literature? Literature forums typically are composed of, essentially, smaller book clubs. The problem is that book clubs will have a group of people that you'll have to edge your way into and they'll be going at a specific pace and roadmap. On the other hand, with Qitab, you're not beholden to the whims of a book club etc. Instead, you start with structured questions to engage you with your text so you have the upside of a book club without being a part of one _and_ when you're ready, you can search out other people on Qitab who are also reading the book so you can engage when you want.

I hope that answers your questions! It would be awesome if you could visit http://qitab.club and sign up (you're e-mail is 100% confidential and _will not_ be shared with advertisers etc.) -- that'll be a really great vote of confidence and I can follow up with you as we're developing.


One option is Wolfram Tones (tones.wolfram.com/generate). It uses cellular automatons (so not quite AI but achieves your goal) to generate music.

- You can change the type of music (Jazz, Classic etc.), select instruments and so on

- You can download the music as well

The only downside is that you can only get a maximum of 30 seconds. What you can do however, is go to their free programming lab and write some code to generate any length that you might want.


I second your recommendations and would like to add the blog "Farnam Street." [1] Mostly because, when it comes to reading, it emphasizes comparing and contrasting books and evaluating arguments and having them checked by others.

Getting your arguments checked by others is critical to making sure your arguments actually make sense in form.

Furthermore, if you are interested in getting started with philosophy I would recommend starting with some books in the "Very Short Introductions" series. Not all of them are good but some of them are and enough of a jumping off point.

[1]: https://fs.blog/blog/

edit: added link


Have you seen Outdoors Stackexchange [1]? It has questions and answers on a variety of topics and although it might not have a definitive guide to camping for first timers, it definitely has plenty of questions and answers that would help.

And the great thing is, you can ask questions too!

[1]: https://outdoors.stackexchange.com/questions


I hadn't, thanks!


"personal CRM" - this fits exactly with what followup.cc is doing and what you described. The only downside is that it only works with GMail and Chrome(mium).

I use it and have found it really useful.


Have you tried using Mathematica instead? Mathematica has instant visualization and makes it very easy to import json/xml/csv.

The other advantage is that you have a full language (Wolfram Language) in the event you want to do further evaluation.


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